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The Quran => Women => Topic started by: yahya on July 08, 2016, 08:07:44 AM

Title: why were the prophets wives not allowed to remarry after the prophets death
Post by: yahya on July 08, 2016, 08:07:44 AM
Assalam alikum i was just wondering why was the prophets wives not allowed to remarry after the prophet death jazzakkallah
Title: Re: why were the prophets wives not allowed to remarry after the prophets death
Post by: Joseph Islam on July 08, 2016, 04:44:43 PM
Wa alaikum assalam Yayha

A great amount of honour was bestowed by God on the wives of the final prophet of God. They were given the status of the 'mother' of the believers (33:6) and informed that they were not like other women (33:32). Their reward was doubled (33:31) and their answerability including punishment if they transgressed was doubled. (33:30)

It would then be inconceivable both from a spiritual (mother) and from a practical perspective that these women would then be able to marry and engage with other men after this status was conferred post the prophet's death. This would be considered an enormity in the sight of God (33:53). Undoubtedly, God's wisdom is absolute and albeit we can continue to surmise the multi-faceted nature of such a command by God, even at a cursory level, the wisdom appears quite evident why such a command was given.

The only exception that could be argued would be if they were to seek divorce from the prophet during the prophet's life (33:28).

I hope this helps, God willing.
Joseph
Title: Re: why were the prophets wives not allowed to remarry after the prophets death
Post by: yahya on July 10, 2016, 07:25:45 PM
I still don't fully understand sorry if the wives could get a divorce and then get married why couldn't They get married after the prophets death jazzakkallah etc and if you could explain what you said again the first time a bit more what you mean because I don't understand what you mean sorry jazzakkallah sorry to keep bothering you
Title: Re: why were the prophets wives not allowed to remarry after the prophets death
Post by: Hamzeh on July 11, 2016, 07:57:44 AM
Asalamu Alykum Yahya

If the wives of the Prophet were to remain with him till his death then they were warned that marriage after that was not permitted. This would be considered an enormity in the sight of God (33:53) like brother Joseph had mentioned.

They did have the chance to be set free if they wished and they would not of been the wives of the Prophet any longer if they were to divorce him before his demise. (33:28). However there is nothing that shows this ever or did happen. Those who became and remained with the Prophet until his death was simply told that marriage was not allowed for them.

The fact that they were given the right to be set free with something in their hands and walk away with a generous settlement of divorce suggests that the prohibition from God that marriage after the Prophets death was not linked to a wish the Prophet may of wanted.

Like brother Joseph mentioned earlier " They were given the status of the 'mother' of the believers (33:6) and informed that they were not like other women (33:32). Their reward was doubled (33:31) and their answerability including punishment if they transgressed was doubled. (33:30)"


Salam
Title: Re: why were the prophets wives not allowed to remarry after the prophets death
Post by: yahya on July 11, 2016, 03:19:47 PM
Ok thanks jazzakkallah I understand now so also it has nothing to do with what some sunnies say in a hadith that they can't get married again after his death because if they did they would have to stay with there last husband and couldn't be with the prophet after in jannah in paradise that they like all women would not have a choice and be forced to stay with the last husband that they all women could not choose who they want too be with weather the last or first or someone else or a new compion if you know what I mean jazzakkallah so it doesn't mean this as well of what the sunnies say with that hadith and using the quran verse saying enter jannah you and your wifes so this doesn't mean this the verse or hadith of what the sunnies say jazzakkallah so it doesn't mean this jazzakkallah is that right
Title: Re: why were the prophets wives not allowed to remarry after the prophets death
Post by: Joseph Islam on July 11, 2016, 03:37:53 PM
Jazāk Allāhu Khayran brother Hamzeh  :)
Title: Re: why were the prophets wives not allowed to remarry after the prophets death
Post by: Hamzeh on July 12, 2016, 06:25:30 AM
Insha'Allah And to you too my dear brother Joseph Jazak Allahu Khayran Insha'Allah  :)
Title: Re: why were the prophets wives not allowed to remarry after the prophets death
Post by: yahya on July 12, 2016, 01:13:28 PM
Assalam alikum so what about what I just said about the sunnies hadith and quran verse they've used etc jazzakkallah if you could get back to me that would be great jazzakkallah
Title: Re: why were the prophets wives not allowed to remarry after the prophets death
Post by: deleted on July 12, 2016, 01:39:56 PM
Peace. Do you have references to them?
Title: Re: why were the prophets wives not allowed to remarry after the prophets death
Post by: Hamzeh on July 12, 2016, 05:39:11 PM
Asalamu Alykum Yahya

The verse you maybe referring to is 43:70

43:70 Enter Paradise, you and your wives, in happiness.

This verse mentions nothing about how many husbands a women had or vice versa. This verse is giving glad tidings in general to men and women that are married which are believers that they will be told to enter Paradise. Some may even translate this verse as follows. The word " Azwaj " is used many times in the Quran. (2:25, 3:15, 16:72, 35:11, 38:58...)

43:70 Enter Paradise, you and your kinds, delighted.

Please look at how the word is used in 3:15

3:15 Say: Shall I give you glad tidings of things Far better than those? For the righteous are Gardens in nearness to their Lord, with rivers flowing beneath; therein is their eternal home; with companions pure (and holy); and the good pleasure of Allah. For in Allah's sight are (all) His servants,-

2:25 But give glad tidings to those who believe and work righteousness, that their portion is Gardens, beneath which rivers flow. Every time they are fed with fruits therefrom, they say: "Why, this is what we were fed with before," for they are given things in similitude; and they have therein companions pure (and holy); and they abide therein (for ever).

God knows best but it seems like the the "Azwaj" that God is telling us about are not something we are familiar with.

Also please this verse 13:23

13:23 Gardens of perpetual bliss: they shall enter there, as well as the righteous among their fathers, their spouses, and their offspring: and angels shall enter unto them from every gate (with the salutation)

Verse 13:23 clearly states that those that are righteous and not all of them will be entering. Its clear from the Quran that at times a father(Prophet Abrahams father) or a wife(Prophet Lot's wife) or a son(Prophet Noahs son) of Prophets were not believers. And also we note an incident that a husband is not a believer and his wife is (example is Pharaoh and his wife)

Also thats right what ever you heard about the hadith mentioning would conflict with the Quran's message. From what i am gathering is that women will only be in paradise with the last husband they married. What about if the last husband was not a believer? What about if the first husband was a believer and the wife was not a believer but final husband was also a believer? This all doesn't make sense. Again you have to remember that you are comparing two different worlds with two different ways of interactions.

Please brother Yahya take inconsideration what was written in the articles by brother Joseph Islam. [1][2][3]  :)

Insha'Allah you will realize that these personal relationships and feelings will be different in ways we will not understand. God will create us a new creation in which we cannot understand. We won't have thoughts that are ill upsetting or jealousy Insha'Allah. Insha'Allah we will be from those who are the closest to the Almighty Lord and bestow upon His Grace, Protection and Mercy and admit us to the gardens of bliss. Insha'Allah

[1] UNDERSTANDING DIFFERENT WORLDS
https://facebook.com/joseph.a.islam/posts/420605631409903

[2] Wordly couples in Jannah?
http://quransmessage.com/forum/index.php?topic=1466.0

[3] women paridise polygamy forced
http://quransmessage.com/forum/index.php?topic=1979.msg9826#msg9826
Title: Re: why were the prophets wives not allowed to remarry after the prophets death
Post by: yahya on July 12, 2016, 11:57:43 PM
Thanks so hamzah are you saying that you believe that women will be with there last husband that they won't have a choice who to be with weather the first or second etc is that what you are saying jazzakkallah
Title: Re: why were the prophets wives not allowed to remarry after the prophets death
Post by: yahya on July 12, 2016, 11:58:46 PM
And this is the hadith what I was talking about. Jazzakkallah. Al-Bayhaqi said:

Muhammad ibn ‘Abd-Allaah al-Haafiz informed us, Abu’l-‘Abbaas Muhammad ibn Ya’qoob told us, Yahyaa ibn Abi Taalib told us, Ishaaq ibn Abi Taalib told us, Ishaaq ibn Mansoor told us, ‘Eesaa ibn ‘Abd al-Rahmaan al-Sulami told us, from Abu Ishaaq from Silah from Hudhayfah (may Allaah be pleased with him), that he said to his wife, “If you want to be my wife in Paradise, do not marry anyone after I die, for in Paradise a woman will be with the last of her husbands in this world. This is why Allaah forbade the wives of the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) to marry anyone after he died, because they will be his wives in Paradise.” (al-Sunan, 7/69)
Title: Re: why were the prophets wives not allowed to remarry after the prophets death
Post by: yahya on July 13, 2016, 12:00:06 AM
And the verses was 13:23 and 36:56 and 43:70 as hamzah said jazzakkallah
Title: Re: why were the prophets wives not allowed to remarry after the prophets death
Post by: deleted on July 13, 2016, 01:49:37 AM
13:23, 36:56, and 43:70 don't state that you'll remain married in the Hereafter, to those you're married to in the Here.
Title: Re: why were the prophets wives not allowed to remarry after the prophets death
Post by: Hamzeh on July 13, 2016, 04:18:14 AM
Salam brother Yahya

I am NOT saying I believe that a women will be with her last husband.

What I believe is that believing righteous people will be together with their believing familes and people of their like who believe and are righteous. We CANNOT assume their will be the same kinds of marriages  and relationships and that a man or women will only have one companion. We also CANNOT assume we will have the same sexuality as we do in the present life.

Like it was mentioned before we will be a new creation something we cannot understand yet.

Also the hadith that you posted seems to be in conflict with the message of the Quran.

First Abu Ishaaq guaranteed himself that he will be going to heaven when the Quran tells us we all don't know what will happen but we can only hope. Believers dont speak as if they know they are guaranteed in Paradise. We only hope to the Almighty Merciful God that we will be from those who enter Paradise.

Also no where in the Quran does it say what Abu Ishaaq said to his wife that a women will be only with her last husband.

Also the hadith is illustrating that the next life is similar to this present life with marriage and relationships when the Quran tells us we will be will be a new creation that we do not know.

Also brother Yahya the hadith is not explaining any verse from the Quran. It is simply giving a random opinion on why God said something. There is no support for anything said in that hadith from the Quran. Thats akin to me saying my opinion without any valid support from Quranic verses.

An opinion has to have clear support from Quranic verses.

Salam
Title: Re: why were the prophets wives not allowed to remarry after the prophets death
Post by: yahya on July 13, 2016, 03:32:16 PM
Thanks for all the help jazzakkallah I understand now its just 4 more last questions 1. Will there be sex (making love) with are partners in heaven. 2. Will we still be male and female even though we are created a new creation 3. When in says in the quran in 44:54 we will marry you to compions does this mean remarry you to someone from earth or does it mean you will be married and then give another partner husband or wife if it's the second one does that mean you have to have another husband or wife by force that you cant just be married too one like adam and eve etc that you just get remarried if you want each other or choose someone else or does it mean you will have too have another husband or wife on top of your first etc like everyone has too have 2 or more husbands or wifes etc by force or can you reject that if you want jazzakkallah I'm mean what does 44:54 really mean
 jazzakkallah 4. Is there marrige in heaven jazzakkallah
Title: Re: why were the prophets wives not allowed to remarry after the prophets death
Post by: yahya on July 13, 2016, 04:03:55 PM
And sorry 5. What does 52:21 and 40:8 mean does that have anything to do with marriage wives etc forced if you know what I mean jazzakkallah
Title: Re: why were the prophets wives not allowed to remarry after the prophets death
Post by: yahya on July 13, 2016, 04:09:24 PM
Sorry to keep bothering you with all this but I do appreciate it thanks jazzakkallah
Title: Re: why were the prophets wives not allowed to remarry after the prophets death
Post by: Hamzeh on July 13, 2016, 04:31:44 PM
Asalamu alykum Yahya

Please brother if you can for just a moment think about what was written to you earlier in the posts from brother Joseph and us other members. You will realize that:

1. In the next world our bodies will not be the same as we are now. We will be a new creation that we can not imagine. No matter what we think or dream we are unable to fathom the look or make.

2. In the life to come for the believers there will NOT be any ill thoughts, malice, or rancor. There will not be any bad talking. We will not feel shame or jealousy.

3. For believers the life of the next world is only good and everlasting. Whatever one does is good.

Now keeping the above in your mind and taking them inconsideration.

If there was any pleasures in the next world they will certainly not be like the ones we have here. The next world is a better place. Whatever pleasures we have it will certainly be pure.

Just so I do not add extra information to what the Quran details. If there was marriages it will not be the same as here. There maybe difference in how God may created the male compared to the female. What is more important is that it will be pure no shame no guilt no ill words.

Remember God can create anything. The whole physical world of the next life maybe differently.

Please refer to the older posts for referances of the Quranic verses.

Now ask yourself brother Yahya all the questions you have asked while keeping the above in your head without adding any information to them. Insha'Allah you will see that the questions are meaningless to those in heaven as whatever they do wont feel bad or shameful and everything will be great Insha'Allah.

Peace
Title: Re: why were the prophets wives not allowed to remarry after the prophets death
Post by: yahya on July 13, 2016, 04:36:39 PM
Ok thanks but what does 44:54 mean and 52:20/21 and 40:8 mean thow jazzakkallah
Title: Re: why were the prophets wives not allowed to remarry after the prophets death
Post by: yahya on July 13, 2016, 06:25:53 PM
And 2:230 because sunnies use this verse as well to say that in the hereafter the women will be forced to stay with the last husband etc if you can answer these I won't ask any more questions again on this subject jazzakkallah
Title: Re: why were the prophets wives not allowed to remarry after the prophets death
Post by: deleted on July 13, 2016, 09:39:55 PM
Peace. 52:21 is a statement that the righteous shall be admitted into the gardens. 40:8 is a supplication as to that.
Title: Re: why were the prophets wives not allowed to remarry after the prophets death
Post by: deleted on July 13, 2016, 09:40:26 PM
2:230 is about the conditions of remarriage.
Title: Re: why were the prophets wives not allowed to remarry after the prophets death
Post by: Hamzeh on July 14, 2016, 12:53:39 AM
Asalamu Alykum Yahya

Verse 2:230 is guidance on how a couple should handle a divorce situation in the PRESENT life. And just like brother Eliiah pointed out that it explains the conditions of remarriage between couples in this life if a divorce has already happened three times.

Verse 44:54 I believe is informing believers both men and women that God will pair them or wed them to fair ones with wide, lovely eyes. If you look at the context of the verse and go back to verse 44:51 you will realize this is a gift to all those who are men and women who keep their duty to their Lord. (Muttaqeena). Someone please correct me or confirm if this means only men and not women as I note in the Quran verse 33:35 speaks about men and women separately by using the "eena" and "nati" to describe man and women. However somehow I feel that "eena" as in Muttaqeena may refer to both man and women because in verse 2:2 it is also used and seems only logical to base that for both men and women.

Again verse 52:21 is referring both man and women that they will be wed or paired with fair ones with wide lovely eyes. The term "Hurin" does not seem like its a reference to humans. God knows best. But again if you look at the context starting from verse 52:17 it is a reference to all those both men and women who are "Muttaqeena".

When the word wed them(Zawwajnahum) is used we cannot think of it in terms of this world.

Verse 40:8 seems to be a prayer from the Angels who bear the throne of God and who are around it. They are asking God to forgive those who repented and followed God's way. They make a prayer to God to allow the believing men and women to enter the gardens of paradise. That their fathers their spouses(Azwajihim) and their descendants who also do righteousness to also be with them.
Again please correct me or confirm if I made a mistake in saying spouses rather than wives.


Please also see article below for a clarification on how the term Hur is used in the Quran. [1]


Peace and blessings Insha'Allah
 
[1]SEXY FEMALE VIRGINS FOR MEN IN PARADISE - REALLY?
http://quransmessage.com/articles/sexy%20female%20virgins%20for%20men%20in%20heaven%20FM3.htm
Title: Re: why were the prophets wives not allowed to remarry after the prophets death
Post by: deleted on July 14, 2016, 01:46:10 AM
Peace. I think "and we'll couple them" is an accurate translation of "وَزَوَّجْنَاهُمْ".
Title: Re: why were the prophets wives not allowed to remarry after the prophets death
Post by: yahya on July 14, 2016, 02:21:37 PM
Thanks so 44:54 and 52:21 when it say wed them or couple them does that mean remarry to earthy husbands and wifes or does it mean you will be already married when you enter after choosing who you want to be with and then marrying you off to new people etc and does these 2 verses imply forcefulness meaning you have to have another husband or wife on top of your first one meaning can you decide just to be with your husband and wife like a single couple like adam and eve or do you have to have more or are these verses just offering if you want more but not forcesing meaning it's your choice to have more or not that you don't have to have more if you don't want more meaning it's your choice etc is that right this is just a clarification jazzakkallah
Title: Re: why were the prophets wives not allowed to remarry after the prophets death
Post by: deleted on July 14, 2016, 11:28:05 PM
Peace. Our Lord doesn't tell us.
Title: Re: why were the prophets wives not allowed to remarry after the prophets death
Post by: yahya on July 15, 2016, 12:39:58 AM
Thanks And what does 36:56 mean jazzakkallah
Title: Re: why were the prophets wives not allowed to remarry after the prophets death
Post by: yahya on July 15, 2016, 01:01:49 AM
And 52:20 sorry in your options and the verse I just said 36:56 etc jazzakkallah
Title: Re: why were the prophets wives not allowed to remarry after the prophets death
Post by: deleted on July 15, 2016, 01:37:58 AM
That from "to couple" is again used in 36:56, and 52:20. From 52:20: "وَزَوَّجْنَاهُمْ بِحُورٍ عِينٍ" ("and we'll couple them with hurin 'inin"[1]). The  "وَأَزْوَاجُهُمْ" of 36:56 likely also refers to the Houris of 52:20.

[1] See Josephs descriptions of Houris (http://quransmessage.com/articles/sexy%20female%20virgins%20for%20men%20in%20heaven%20FM3.htm).
Title: Re: why were the prophets wives not allowed to remarry after the prophets death
Post by: yahya on July 15, 2016, 02:45:56 AM
Ok thanks jazzakkallah so if we wanted just one person to be like a adam and eve can we have that or do (forcefully) we have to have more than one partner etc or can we just have one and be one couple like adam and eve or do we be forced to have more than one partner etc if you know what I mean jazzakkallah
Title: Re: why were the prophets wives not allowed to remarry after the prophets death
Post by: deleted on July 15, 2016, 04:01:06 AM
Peace. Again our Lord doesn't tell us.
Title: Re: why were the prophets wives not allowed to remarry after the prophets death
Post by: Hamzeh on July 15, 2016, 07:05:31 AM
Asalamu Alykum Yahya

Just some background information that Adam and his wife were arguably not created in the "Jannah" that is mostly thought of from a traditional point of view which is Paradise. The term “Jannah” which also carries the meaning of “Garden" is more possibly referring to a earthly place in this life.

Please see the related article below[6]

you asked
Quote
so 44:54 and 52:21 when it say wed them or couple them does that mean remarry to earthy husbands and wifes or does it mean you will be already married when you enter after choosing who you want to be with and then marrying you off to new people etc

That verse 44:54 specifically does not mean they will be remarried to earthly husbands or wifes. However from other verses God has informed us that believing family members and spouses will be able to see each other. Verse 44:54 speaks about "Hoorin"

There is nothing in the verses that states someone will already be married when they enter heaven, or marriage has been selected for them.

God tells us in a way of a glad tiding something to look forward to, that believers will have companions, friends, that will be pure and a joy to the eye. God will pair or couple the believers with them.

44:51-54
Indeed, the righteous will be in a secure place;
Within gardens and springs,
Wearing [garments of] fine silk and brocade, facing each other.
Even so (it will be). And We shall wed(pair)(zawwajnahum) them unto fair ones with wide, lovely eyes(hoorinAAeen).

To confirm again verse 51 to 54 informs us that God will give a gift to both those men and women who are righteous that He will pair them (or wed them in a different way than on earth) companions who are pure fair ones with lovely eyes. Nothing to do with marriage with earthly couples. Please remember marriage on earth requires laws and agreements and so on. God is saying in that verse this is something yet to come.

you said
Quote
does these 2 verses imply forcefulness meaning you have to have another husband or wife on top of your first one meaning can you decide just to be with your husband and wife like a single couple like adam and eve or do you have to have more or are these verses just offering if you want more but not forcesing meaning it's your choice to have more or not that you don't have to have more if you don't want more meaning it's your choice

Even in this earthly world we are not forced to marry anyone. How then in heaven?
You still have not changed your question pattern and still implying that marriage in heaven is the same as earth. Your making it sound like there is betrayal and unfaithfulness and lewdness in heaven. Please understand Heaven is a place of peace, enjoyment and bliss. Nothing will be disturbing. Heaven is far better than this life. God the Maker of everything tells us that.
 
Pickthall
(36:56) They and their wives, in pleasant shade, on thrones reclining;

Yusuf Ali
(36:56) They and their associates will be in groves of (cool) shade, reclining on Thrones (of dignity);

To understand the word “azwajuhum” as wives just shows that one is understanding this verse separately without reading the context. However that still does not mean that they will be married in the same way as we humans are married on earth.

Now if the verse is read IN CONTEXT with the previous verse as it should be done you will realize that ALL the inhabitants dwellers of Paradise will be in pleasant shade on thrones reclining with their “azwajuhum” meaning pairs companions. This could be a reference to the hurs as brother Eliiah stated in verse 44:54.

35:55
Verily, the dwellers of the Paradise, that Day, will be busy in joyful things.

35:56
They and their associates will be in groves of (cool) shade, reclining on Thrones (of dignity);

Brother Yahya I'll post the related articles and thread below and if you need more information on this topic please go over them again. :) Insha'Allah you will understand the perspective shared to the best of our abilities which I find in complete agreement with the verses of the Quran. I feel I'm starting to repeat myself over and over without any new information.

Salam

[1] UNDERSTANDING DIFFERENT WORLDS
https://facebook.com/joseph.a.islam/posts/420605631409903

[2] Wordly couples in Jannah?
http://quransmessage.com/forum/index.php?topic=1466.0

[3] women paridise polygamy forced
http://quransmessage.com/forum/index.php?topic=1979.msg9826#msg9826

[4] Hurs
http://quransmessage.com/forum/index.php?topic=2012.msg10017#msg10017

[5] SEXY FEMALE VIRGINS FOR MEN IN PARADISE - REALLY?
http://quransmessage.com/articles/sexy%20female%20virgins%20for%20men%20in%20heaven%20FM3.htm

[6] ADAM (pbuh) AND JANNAH - AN EARTHLY ABODE OR PARADISE?
http://quransmessage.com/articles/adam%20and%20jannah%20FM3.htm
Title: Re: why were the prophets wives not allowed to remarry after the prophets death
Post by: yahya on July 15, 2016, 08:53:50 PM
Ok thanks maybe to sum up everything to the point and some scholars are of the opion 1. does everyone enter to paridise single and then married of or 2. just some enter single and some enter married to paridise or 3. does everyone eneter married to paridise.
Title: Re: why were the prophets wives not allowed to remarry after the prophets death
Post by: yahya on July 16, 2016, 05:45:21 PM
Any thoughts jazzakkallah
Title: Re: why were the prophets wives not allowed to remarry after the prophets death
Post by: QM Moderators Team on July 16, 2016, 10:47:41 PM
Yayha,

Please can you kindly consider your posts and stop almost badgering forum members for responses. You seem to ask questions very quickly without giving much appreciation for the immense time other forum members are spending to answer your question in detail. Please also try to do some study yourself rather just ask questions repeatedly .....

Thanks!