Messages

[with it]

peace,

As a starting point it is important to have an accurate translation of the verses: [source]

Establish the salat at the setting of the sun to the darkness of the night; and the reading (of) dawn; indeed, the reading (of) dawn is witnessed. [17:78]
And from the night so remain awake with it additionally for yourself, perhaps your Lord will raise you (to) a status praiseworthy. [17:79]

The "with it" (Arabic: bi hi) refers to a preceding masculine noun, and thus can ONLY refer to "reading" (Arabic: quran). Note that "salat" is a feminine noun. Thus, the idea of "the tahajjud prayer" is not possible unless one considers it as a reading (also see 73:20).

"tahajjud prayer"?

I am like 6 years religious and i stopped 3 years ago with praying like the sunnis.

Like i said, i believe 17:78 has the detail of what prayer is, to read the Quran. It's that simple. It says the Quran at dawn is witnessed, so when we pray, we read the Quran.

I don't even bow and kneel like the sectarians, i learned that soejdoed and roekoeh mean to submit and yield to the Message of God when reading the Quran. The Quran teaches that Mary used to perform the sjoedjoed and roekoeh, the Gospel doesn't teach anything at all about a prayer that looks like that of the sectarian sunnis/shia. I am 100% sure that soedjoed and roekoeh mean to submit and yield to Gods Message when reading Them.
By the way i am not talking out of my neck here, the Arabic language supports this understanding and a word for word study on these words will confirm it.

Anyways, i wish you the best. That's my understanding.

To my knowledge this is accurate: [source]

2:198
Not is on you blame to seek bounty from your Lord, so when you proceeded from familiarisations/recognitions** then remember God in the presence of the inviolable place of perception/markers/practices*** and remember Him as He has guided you; for you were straying before that.

** 'arafaat (pl. of 'arafat, masculine 'araf, being a version of 'aarif, the active form of 'arafa and/or 'arfun, the informational noun of 'arafa) can mean 'familiarizations, approbations, recognitions.' See 49:13 for example.
*** Arabic: "al mash'aar al haram" literally means: the inviolable place of awareness/perception/knowledge and/or where "sha3air" are found/practiced, and most likely refers to the locality. The form "maf3al" (same as "mashAAr") is most commonly used to denote place in AQ, see end of this article. It may be interesting to note the difference in form between "masjid" and "mash'aar", which also suggests a possible difference in meaning.

If this translation is correct then i think aarafatin and almashaar alharaam refer to the Kaaba.

2:198 There is no sin upon you to seek goodness from your Lord. So when you disperse from the elevated place, then remember God at the symbol which is restricted, and remember Him as He has guided you; for you were straying before that.

[ever mean a physical act.]

You are making a claim here that the words for bowing and prostrating in the Quran do not ever mean a physical act.

You then expand this claim to the previous scriptures. As are trying to prove something against, you have to provide evidence, not me.

The irony is in your own statement to me :

There is a difference between reading in context and reading parts of Scripture with biased thoughts

You are being hypocritical in my opinion by only allowing one meaning for sujood and rukuh when there actually is more than one meaning ...so maybe you should be 'reading in context'

These Quranists that have an allergy to physical prayer have decided to translate the verses by 'reading parts of the Scripture with biased thoughts'

They are probably the same bunch who don't believe in Fasting or Hajj being physical acts!

I believe in a physical pilgrimage to the Restricted Temple in Makkah in the four restricted months according to a luni-solar calendar and i believe the four restricted months begin when the month of scorching heat (ramadan) appears in July.

I base that understanding upon the meaning of the Arabic word "ramadan" and 6:96, 10:5 and 9:81 of the Quran.

I wish you the best in your studies.

The hadiths fabricated after the death of the Prophet have many contradictions among themselves. There are contradictions between the Quran and the hadiths.

hostility to women

"I will not frustrate that no man or woman produces from you. You are all from each other."
(Surah Ali Imran 195)

"O women, you are hell wood."
(Bukhari-Muslim-Abu Dawud-Nesai)


God help us.

"I didn't leave more harm to men than women."
(Steam-Muslim-Tirmidhi)

Who will see the greatest punishment

"Allah truly does not forgive his associate. He also forgives the rest for whom He will."

(Surat al-Nisa 48)

"the most severe punishment in hell is the painter."

(steam-tesavir, 89)

can men wear gold? Can you wear silk?

"O believers! Do not forbid the clean and beautiful of the things which Allah has rendered halal to you; do not exceed the limit; Allah does not love the transgressors."

(verse 87)

Say, kim Who has forbidden the ornament and clean provision of Allah for His worshipers?

(Surat Araf 32)

"Gold and silk are halal for the women of my ummah and haram for the men.

(Abu Dawud-Nasai-Ibn Mace)

"Gold and silk are forbidden for all who believe"

(Steam-Muslim-Tirmizî-Nasai)

who will intercede?

Say: "All intercession belongs to Allah. To Him belongs the dominion of the heavens and the earth. Then you will be returned to Him."
(Surah al-Zumar)

O Abu Huraira, because I had seen his ambition to learn the hadith, I had already known that no one would ask me before this hadith. On the Day of Judgment, the most prominent person from the people to the Compassion is the person who says "lâ ilehe illallah la through his heart or inside."
(Bukhari, science, 33)

God's calf?

"there is nothing like it."
(Surat al-Shura 11)

In the Hereafter, God will show the prophets his leg and show his calf to prove his identity. "
(Muslim-faith 302; steam 97/24, 10/29; hanbel 3/1)

God shake hands?

"Nothing is his equivalent."
(4)

the person who changes religion is killed?

"there is no pressure in religion."
(Surat al-Baqarah 256)

Kill the one who changed his religion. "
(NESA-vapor)

The verses and hadiths I gave above contradict each other. because all hadiths are fabrication.

Good work brother. May God reward you for exposing their system of falsehood.

[no physical act of bowing and prostrating]

As you hold the stance that there is no physical act of bowing and prostrating in the previous scriptures, it is up to you to provide evidence and proof to us.

You should read the the Hebrew and Aramaic lexicons and show us here that there is no physical bowing, prostrating, kneeling etc.

Lol, you claim that the Gospel and Torah teach to bow and prostrate during a daily prayer. I told you that they don't teach such a thing, nor does the Quran teach such a thing.

There is a difference between reading in context and reading parts of Scripture with biased thoughts.

Hello, I am Quranfaithul. In this article, I will show that the Qur'an and the sect contradict each other. I will show that the sects contradict each other.


Meaning of the word, to be followed, the way to go, accepted means of opinion.

Sects have their own contradictory environments. Examples include;

What is the obligation of ablution?

Hanafi sect, 4
Shafi'i sect 6
Sect of Maliki 7
hanbeli sect, 7

What is the number of things that break the ablution?

Hanafi 12
Sharif sect 5
Sect of Maliki 3
hanbeli sect, 8

Does blood break fasting?

Hanafi no
Sharif, no
Maliki graduate, no
Hanbeli, yes

What is the status of the pilgrim?

Hanafi 2
Sharif sect 5
Sect of Maliki 4
Hanbeli sect 4

Is it possible to dress the child with silk?

Hanafi no
Shafii sect, yes
Maliki graduate, no
hanbeli, yes

Is it forbidden to cut your beard?

Hanafi, yes
Shafi'i cult, no
Maliki, yes
Hanbeli, yes

Backgammon is forbidden to play?

Hanafi no
Shafii sect, yes
Maliki graduate, yes
Hanbeli, yes

Is it allowed to dominate a woman?

Hanafi, yes
Shafi'i cult, no
Maliki graduate, no
Hanbeli, no

According to the examples you see above, there is a lot of contradiction between the sects.

The Koran is against sects.

Surah, 159. verse: "There are those who divide their religion into fractions, fractions, factions. You have nothing to do with them. Their work is up to Allah.

Qur'an Surah Imran 105.ayet: "Do not enter into a quarrel after the evidences come to them and do not be divided into sects.

Surah Imran 103.ayet: "Together, embrace the rope of God, do not split into the frigates"

According to the above verses of the Qur'an, the Qur'an stood against the sects.

40 surah yusuf: "Only Allah is power"

The sects outside the Qur'an give provisions about halal haram. This event is an open company. Because only God makes his own decision.

Surah ankebut, verse 51: "Is it not enough for us to download a book read in front of them? Of course there is compassion and reminder to a believing society."

denominations are inadequate according to the Qur'an, judging them. The verses in the Qur'an clearly state that the Qur'an tells us that the Holy Qur'an is sufficient and will be questioned according to this book.

Surah Zuhruf (44): "This is a reminder to you and the community, of course, a reminder / honor / reminder. You will be held responsible for it."

4 The right to use the word sect is a shirk.


The Koran and the sect contradict each other

May God help us.

Welcome, may God reward you for exposing their false system.

May God bless your reading of the Quran, and protect you against sectarianism and fabricated doctrines and traditions.

[very similar]

So if sujood and rukuh don't mean the physical act of  bowing or prostrating, which arabic words do?

The Christians do kneel and bow plus the traditional Jewish prayer is very similar to the way the Muslim do.


The physical act of praying seems to bother so many quranists that they are changing the meaning of keys words and what we have in it's place doesn't 'fit' very well in my opinion.

So standing up in front of your Creator and physically bowing to Him to show your submission is beneath you?

There is not such a thing in the Bible as a daily prayer which evolves physical bowing and kneeling. You should read the Bible from cover to cover.

We are actually returning to the original meaning of the words and the Quran. Go do a word for word study yourself.. you will find out roekoeh and soejoed mean to yield and submit.

God asked the Angels to submit to Adam. Soejoed is used here. Or do you think God asked the Angels to fall down on their foreheads to Adam, and do you think the Angels were following the writings of bukhari & co?
There is not even such a thing as falling down on your forehead in the Quran, there is only the falling down on their chins, which symbolizes how they reject their ego and pride and submit to the Truth.
Etc.

We yield and submit to what God told us. Bowing and kneeling is a pagan thing.

Assalamualaikum brother Joseph. I'm quite confused about the Qur'anic stance on previous scriptures. Are they corrupted or not? I've read three of your articles that the Qur'an confirms the revelations that were present at the 6th and 7th centuries. If that's the case then how can we reconcile the huge theological differences between the Qur'an and the Gospels? One example is the crucifixion of Jesus AS. How can the Qur'an confirms the Gospels when it clearly shows that Paul preached that Jesus was crucified, died, and was raised back to life? Not only that, what about the concept of original sin, also preached by Paul, which is something alien to both the Torah and the Qur'an?

Speaking about the Torah, the Qur'an confirms that the Torah is like the Qur'an in terms of it's beautiful recitation at verses 28:48-49. How can this be when the Torah is wrought with scribal errors and human interference. Doesn't the Torah depicts the Prophets in a negative light like David lusting over a married woman? Doesn't the Qur'an corrects the story of Prophet Job which is depicted abhorrently in the Torah? Doesn't the Qur'an corrects the story of Noah who was featured ad DRUNKARD in the Torah? Doesn't the Torah depicts Solomon AS as a polytheists? I know that the name of the sacrificial son is not explicitly mentioned in the Qur'an but it is clearly implied to be Ishmael when we read that the FORBEARING SON in verse 37:101 is supported by verse 21:85 when it mentions Ishmael to be among the patient. Doesn't the Qur'an said that they're prophecies regarding Prophet Muhammad in the Torah? Besides Isaiah 42, the current Torah is not very explicit with regards to any Prophecies pertaining to the Prophet SAW. How can we reconcile these conflicts and contradictions when the Qur'an is said to confirm the previous scriptures. Unfortunately many scholars have overlooked this and I fear you have as well. I need help

The Quran confirms the Torah and the Gospel:

An English translation of the Quran - 5:68 Say: "O people of the Book, you are not upon anything until you uphold the Torah and the Gospel and what was sent down to you from your Lord." And for many of them, what was sent down to you from your Lord will only increase them in transgression and rejection. So do not feel sorry for the rejecting people.

Muhammad was telling the people of the Bible to uphold the Torah and the Gospel. Don't let these Quran centric people misguide you about this matter.

God went even further and said:

An English translation of the Quran - 5:47 And let the people of the Gospel judge with what God has sent down in it. And whoever does not judge with what God has sent down, then these are the wicked.

So the Christians should even judge with the Gospel.

There should be no question about the Bible. Else they are believing in a Quran that contradicts itself..
There are many translations of the Bible. When i say Bible i mean the Hebrew and Greek one.
These misguided people who claim to follow the Quran are rejecting it when it clearly confirms the previous Scriptures in many verses. They use incorrect translations of the Bible to suit their sectarian doctrine about It. Don't be like them..

About the crucifixion, context is key. I read it as this: They didn't crucify him nor did they kill him, because they were saying that, but God raised him up to Him. So the Quran confirms the Resurrection, else it wouldn't say that he didn't die of a crucifixion, but that he was raised to God.
The sectarian Israelites used to say that they killed Jesus, and that they crucified him. But they didn't, God raised him up to Him.

The Gospel says that Paul is hard to understand and that misguided people twist hes words. So have patience, learn Greek if you really want to find out what the original Injeel says.

You are now only showing the human side of the prophets in the previous Scriptures. What about David fighting for God to establish a kingdom for God here on earth? What about Job learning from what he received from God and eventually having patience for what befell him? What about Noah having faith in God and being a vessel that would clean the whole world? What about Solomon repenting and building the first Restricted Temple in Jerusalem for God?

The Torah and Injeel tell us by name that it was Isaac. I checked in Hebrew and Greek. If you read the Quran closely, Abraham is asking for a righteous son in 37:100-101, then later in 37:112 God responds with telling us He gave him Isaac. So even the Quran is actually saying it is Isaac.

God protected the Torah and Zabur/Psalms up to Jesus Christ, later the Quran confirmed both the Torah and Zabur/Psalms and the Injeel/Gospel. Then why would they suddenly change after the Quran confirming them and telling their people to uphold them and judge even with it. Only sectarians and people influenced by the devils say such a thing.

Learn Arabic and read the Quran. Don't have these biased opinions on the Torah and Injeel, go and learn Hebrew and Greek if you really want to know what they say.

You sound like a sectarian Jew or Christian who is telling their people that the Quran is not the Word of God because he is referring to the verses in the Quran that tell us Muhammad did a sin..

The stories you read in the Bible remind us that even prophets are human beings and can be tempted. Man, even the former angel Ibliees, the devil, used to be an angel, but now look at what we hear he is doing..
What matters is how human beings die. All these prophets you talk about in this manner died as righteous human beings who were asking for the forgiveness of God.

17:78? Is it reading the Quran? It says that the Quran at dawn is witnessed, which means that we read the Quran during prayer?

Reading the Quran fits 4:102. The sectarian way of praying doesn't fit 4:102 because they never ever have their leader praying their same prayer session for multiple times and the sectarian prayer was invented later on which can be found in the books of bukhari & co while the Quran is fully detailed and giving answers to everything we need to know for salvation.

Roekoeh and sjoedjoed in Arabic means to yield and submit. If you do a word for word study you will find out that they can't mean the physical bowing and kneeling which is done by the sectarians. It rather means to yield and submit to the Quran when it is being recited or read.

Mary used to submit and yield with those who yield and submit. The whole Bible, from the Torah until the Gospel, will not tell you anything about a prayer method which is done by the sectarians. They used to read the Book as well in their prayer sessions.

If it's location isn't disputed, then it may well be that the pilgrims visit the same place that the Quran is referring to.

If someone can give some more information from the Quran about it. Then please do.

I read the Quran just twice from cover to cover. So i might miss it.

So i wonder what the place is, and if it is the current place as people say in general.

Perfect example is the Israelites in the Torah. They go to other countries because they were being persecuted. God didn't say anything about it being wrong to do that in the Torah nor the Quran. He even told us about it in the Scriptures.

Where does the Quran say the believers immigrated to Abbasinia?

Some prophets used to go to other countries. The whole earth is of God.

Salaam,

Are you referring to Qur'an centric people on this forum when you say that they deny the previous scriptures?

I happen to agree with you regarding the previous scriptures being present at the time of the prophet. There are many verses that address the Jews for example, and tells them to refer to their Torah for judgement.

Glad to see someone who isn't biased and believes in the Quranic verses.

I was talking about the Quran centric people in general.

Bakkah in modern Petra? It fits the story in the Torah and the Injeel..

Mount Sinai in Arabia is below the golf of todays Aqaba and above Midian. Above the Mount is the desert of Paran and in that desert did Hagar and Ishmael receive the well from the Angel of the Lord.

Are there others who did some more research? I think i am 100% positive about Petra being Bakkah. It also fits the Zabur when David is singing about the valley of Baca.

I am now trying to figure out if the Restricted Temple is in todays Makkah or not. What about 48:24-25? If not, then there is no Restricted Temple anymore since a long time..?

Does someone know what Arafat, the Restricted Monument is? If someone could explain the truth about verse 2:198, then feel free to share the truth God willingly.