Messages

481

Prophets and Messengers / Re: Giving indication of next Prophet's coming

« on: August 16, 2013, 03:54:15 PM »

Asalamun Alikum

I think also brother Joseph, its worth to mention to most people who believe that messengers will not come after the prophet Muhammad (pbuh), that there is a difference between a prophet and a messenger. I think most people assume that messengers bring new revelations. And most people call Muhammad(pbuh) as a Rasulna(our messenger) instead of Nabeeyna(our prophet)

what most people keep in mind is the Quran is the final revelation and that Muhammad (pbuh) is the final prophet.

So when they hear that messengers will continue to come they first think that how can this happen when the final book is the Quran. People don't understand the difference between them.

Also I dont think I heard of anyone to claim to be a messenger of God, all I actually heard was someone claiming to either be the messiah or the mehdi or a prophet, even though they believe in the Quran. And they end up turning there beliefs into a sect or party.

I think a messenger of the revelation is anyone trying to help out people who never heard of the Quran or the message. And spreading the word. maybe translating the message into other languages and working hard. And not holding to be part of any sects or party or also not taking any fees and not doing it for any self interests. Maybe a site like this is a good example. Allahu Ahlam.

Salam

482

General Discussions / Soul Mates Destined? / Wealth Destined?

« on: August 07, 2013, 08:20:24 PM »

Salamun Alikum to all

1. Is every man and women already written for them who there wives/husbands are going to be? also one starts to think that if thats the case then the unmarried and never does get married is also destined to be like that? example. Naseeb

2. And also another thought that fits in with this is, no matter how hard a person works or tries his end result is always going to be the same? Wether sleeping all day or working hard during the ones life, the wealth is determined before a person is born? example Rizq

couple of years ago i had many discussions with friends that always tried to convince me that everything is always written and pre destined and we just cant change anything and some people are chosen over others. I could never understand there points and always replied to them that they heard wrong and was not a islamic belief, there was just something that you guys are missing. But they swore thats what they heard and ask any sheik? But with little knowledge it is hard to explain to people the matters. So I left the matter alone un-answered. And to be honest I also had many doubts about the fact and doubted that the truth is something like that. A person would have the right to say then why would we be tested and put in either a great place or a bad place for something that was pre-destined? when we know that God is a loving God, most just, most merciful and compassionate.

Recently Alhamdulila I read brother Josephs discussions on "Pre-ordained destiny" which it cleared up sooooo much. Jazak Allah Khair Brother.


Now the question is would the same concept be left for marriage and wealth? As this is also a free will and choice of a person?


Any thoughts?

Peace

483

Discussions / Re: Ourbeacon Forum

« on: August 04, 2013, 09:47:43 PM »

Salam everyone

I was curious about what you guys where talking about. "our beacon"

I searched it up and i went to that site. On the main page after reading the biography of this person Dr.Shabbir Ahmed at the very bottom of the page it says this:

"May Allah bless his ‘self’!"

which i found strange. But i don't know, it could mean something else other than what im thinking?

484

Prophets and Messengers / Re: Difference between messengers and prophets?

« on: August 01, 2013, 07:11:36 PM »

Salamu Alikum brother Joseph

Just to end the discussion incase anyone in the future reads this. I would like to say that I went over your articles again regarding these matters and questioned them with any thoughts that came to mind. With the best of my knowledge I am one to be convinced with your perspective. As I said I would write back to you, I am not going to that since I found your perspective very insightful and beneficial and convincing. Jazak Allah Khair dear brother

Peace be with you

Salam

485

General Discussions / Re: Surah 25:30 and Surah 5:109 question about the two?

« on: July 17, 2013, 07:18:50 AM »

Thank you brother Joseph

Thats for giving me a clarification on what it means. It does make sense now that I think of messenger as a generic term that Allah (swt) uses for his message to be revealed.  And as the prophets are different. 

Salamu alikum

486

General Discussions / Re: Surah 25:30 and Surah 5:109 question about the two?

« on: July 15, 2013, 08:15:43 PM »

Salamu Alikum Brother Joseph

Ramadan Mubarak Inshallah to you

Thank you for your kind reply and clarifying my question. I appreciate it.

I would also assume it would be prophet Muhammad(pbuh) since alrasoolu would be a single and not plural(I think) and because the Quran is of mention.


some people say that new messengers of Allah(swt) are always to come which I think your perspective is similar, but your view is that no new scripture would ever come. Which I agree.

like Bahais they say that they believe in the Quran but because of the verse below they say new messengers are to come. Which I found also that some say that seal of prophethood does not mean "final" or "last" but just means a "stamp" or "confirmation" of prophethood. But just by reading a little bit of their books its easy to tell that its not in connection with the Quran, but seems like its trying to be by stating new sharia laws to this era of people and so on. And then there is other sects that are ahmadiyas, which you are probably familiar with all they also claim that a person today is Gods messengers because to "every nation is a messenger" and the verse below:

Muhammad is not the father of any of your men, but (he is) the Messenger of Allah, and the Seal of the Prophets: and Allah has full knowledge of all things.
(The Holy Quran, Al-Ahzab 33:40)

But just to clarify for myself and for others would I be going against the Quran if I was to say that every messenger of Allah(swt) is a prophet and not every prophet is a messenger of Allah(swt)?

Just for clarification for what im trying to say is that, If prophethood is more holy than messengers(rusul) from Allah(swt), then why are we told to obey the messenger(rasul) and not the Nabi(prophethood)?

And also would you think that the messengers of Allah(swt) the ones he sent with his verses and scriptures like Muhammad, Jesus, Moses, Abraham(pbut) be infallible in the state they were as messengers and not as a prophets? the reason I ask this is because I noticed in the Quran when ever the prophets did some mistakes, Allah(swt) would calls them out by saying Nabi and not Rasul. And another reason is because we are told to Obey Allah and the Rasul never the Nabi. One just inclines to ask, why if the prophets are the ones who brought the revelation and would be infallible in making a mistake when revealing it then wouldn't we be told to obey them as prophets and not the messengers. Because from an article I read from you dear brother, stated prophethood is greater than messenger.

Would a messenger of Allah(swt) be different than a regular normal human messenger from the people or a messenger from amongst ourselves (Rusoolan Minkum) rehearsing verses already sent and present in the hands of people? Or would you say that messengers among ourselves even today would be given inspiration from Allah(swt) from maybe a wahi, angle etc?

And is it rusuls from Allah(swt) who were inspired with revelations or was it Nabis(prophets)?


I am really shy to ask these because I know you went over this before and it would be time consuming trying to find the ayat that relate to all the messengers and prophets and to distinguish the differences.

However Joseph there is a few points that you made which clarified much in my mind about the whole topic, and if the discussion ends here because of exhaustion of the topic I understand and I thank you again so much for your time, and for your kind responses.


Salam

Hamzeh

487

General Discussions / Surah 25:30 and Surah 5:109 question about the two?

« on: July 07, 2013, 03:02:49 PM »

Salamu Alikum

As I was reading the articles  "Understanding the Crucifixion of Jesus (pbuh) from a Quran's Perspective" and "IS THE SECOND COMING OF PROPHET JESUS (pbuh) SUPPORTED BY THE QURAN?" by Brother Joseph Islam. I came to think about something.


in EVIDENCE 3
 
NO MESSENGER WILL KNOW WHAT HAS HAPPENED ON EARTH AFTER THEY DIE
 
005.109
“One day God will gather the messengers together, and ask: "What was the response you received (from men to your teaching)?" They will say: "We have no knowledge: it is You Who knows in full all that is hidden."
 
There is no exclusion for Prophet Jesus (pbuh) in this verse and resonates Prophet Jesus's (pbuh) comments captured in 5:116-117


the above is from IS THE SECOND COMING OF PROPHET JESUS (pbuh) SUPPORTED BY THE QURAN?


And I came to think about this Verse below:


The translation of the qurans surah 25:30 is as follows:



Sahih International
And the Messenger has said, "O my Lord, indeed my people have taken this Qur'an as [a thing] abandoned."

Muhsin Khan
And the Messenger (Muhammad SAW) will say: "O my Lord! Verily, my people deserted this Quran (neither listened to it, nor acted on its laws and orders).

Pickthall
And the messenger saith: O my Lord! Lo! mine own folk make this Qur'an of no account.

Yusuf Ali
Then the Messenger will say: "O my Lord! Truly my people took this Qur'an for just foolish nonsense."

Shakir
And the Messenger cried out: O my Lord! surely my people have treated this Quran as a forsaken thing.

Dr. Ghali
And the Messenger has said, "O Lord! Surely my people have taken to themselves this Qur'an as a thing to be forsaken."




One might think that how can one verse say that all the messengers(pbut) had no knowledge about there people and then the messenger Muhammad(pbuh) knew what his people did by saying they either abandoned or treated the Quran as a forsaken thing?



If I had to give my opinion or guess, the verse 25:30 seems to be taking place on the day of Judgement. Or maybe after that day or the end of it. It makes me think that maybe the Rasul is the witness on the Day of judgement to his people and after seeing the outcome or the result of the peoples trial he says that.

And verse 5:105 is probably being asked before the Judgment has taken place or before trial?

Im not saying the verses are going against each other. But i enjoyed the articles and I thought I would ask about something that came to my mind.


Inshallah Brother Joseph can lend me a few minutes and give me his explanation on the verses or point me to a article that explains them.

Salam

Hamzeh

488

Prophets and Messengers / Re: Difference between messengers and prophets?

« on: July 02, 2013, 07:08:05 AM »

Wa alikum wa salam Joseph

Thanks for your reply. I really appreciate it.

I don't really disagree with your perspective.  I was just asking for a little help on an opinion I had by searching through the quran.  Which I stated initially. I feel by reading lots of your articles that your much more knowledgeable than I am and have much more background Info regarding the quran.  I know you stated that messengers can always remain in your article. But I just wanted to know about what I asked first.  And if it would contradict any other points or verses in the quran. Inshallah I will write to you a better letter in the next few days and you may answer when you like and if you like with all respect taken.

Thank you for sharing your views on many topics which I have benefited from alhamdulila.

Thank you very much salam brother

489

Discussions / Re: Shi'a Doctrine

« on: June 28, 2013, 06:58:43 PM »

Salamu alikum

I just happened to come across this discussion and was giving it a little bit of thought so i decided to give my comment on it. But before I start I would like to say something to people who are really honest and willing to know the truth and not just thinking there way is always best and right. So to begin I would like to say:

To find the truth, complete absolute truth in the life and universe is very hard and maybe impossible for humans. The absolute truth is only for Allah(swt) to know. But we should all try and pray that Allah(swt) grants us wisdom and knowledge and the right path.

So for the truth it requires hardship, struggle, searching, manipulations, sometimes sadness, sometimes deception, sometimes being convinced and assured. Sometimes leaving past beliefs that were once wrong. Pondering and desire, Happiness and success. however even after all that the absolute truth belong to Allah and only Allah(swt). 

As humans we have to give and take and share and respect one another. And try to come to solid facts and think with reason and intellect.

We should not take any mans books and saying as truth with out criticism or questioning and study. Even the holy Quran tells us to study the book of Allah, for thats how one can be convinced its the book of Allah(swt). we should look for contradictions and discrepancies, which we can never find in the Quran.

I was pondering about the ayah that brother Arif stated from the Quran which he is saying that it states the infallibility of the imam Ali or any Ulil amr.

[4:59] O you who believe! Obey Allah and obey the Messenger (Rasul) and those in authority (Ulil-Amr) from among you;  then if you quarrel about anything, refer it to Allah and the  Messenger, if you believe in Allah and the last day; this is better and  very good in the end.


If i was to study this ayah and extract the points being made, I come to an understanding of the following:

1. To those who believe-----> muslims, mu'mins, believers
2. Obey Allah----> the answer is clear That obey Allah(swt)
3. Obey the messenger (Rasul) NOT prophet Muhammad(pbuh)------> pay attention its stating to OBEY THE RASUL NOT PROPHET(NABI)--->If you search in the quran the nabi had made mistakes and was not infallible. But the messenger of Allah is what brings the ayat and the quran and IS INFALLIBLE(mahsuum) of the message being revealed which is the Quran.

4.And those in authority from among you(Ulil-Amr).--------->lets suppose this is Imam Ali, and it can be argued that it was Abu Bakr or Omar or Uthman before him. But lets talk about the Imam Ali as being the one in authority

5.then the ayah states "if you quarrel about anything"-------> what is it that we may quarrel about and with who? Is it possible we can dispute or quarrel with Allah(swt) THE ANSWER IS NO------>is it possible to dispute with the messenger Rasul(which is Infallible about preaching the Quran)---------> THE ANSWER IS NO

SO WHO IS ALLAH ASSUMING WE MIGHT QUARREL WITH OR DISPUTE WITH--------> THE ANSWER IS THE "ONE IN AUTHORITY AMONG YOU" WHICH IN OUR TIME CAN BE ANY IMAN OR LEADER. Or in the past Iman Ali, Or Abu Bakr, etc.

So there is a few points we can make of here.
      A. That Ulil-Amr (those in authority among you) are NOT INFALLIBLE, BECAUSE ITS ASSUMED THERE CAN BE DISPUTES WITH THE LEADERS
      B. That even the prophet Muhammad(pbuh) had some mistakes and maybe he was to refer it also back to the Quran which he himself as a messenger revealed it.
      C. No one after Prophet Muhammad(pbuh) can claim to be a prophet or a messenger of Allah because he was the seal of the prophets and to my best understanding a messenger of Allah(swt) is automatically a prophet.
      D. No human or Ulil Amr can control and say whatever he wants.
     

6. refer it to Allah and the  Messenger, if you believe in Allah and the last day; this is better and  very good in the end.----> AND YOU SHOULD REFER THE DISPUTES BACK TO THE QURAN IF YOU BELIEVE IN ALLAH AND THE LAST DAY; THIS IS BETTER AND VERY GOOD IN THE END

And once again remember this is all to those "WHO BELIEVE"
ITS MENTIONED TWICE

Once in the beginning ---> "OH YOU WHO BELIEVE"

And the ending----> "IF YOU BELIEVE IN ALLAH AND THE LAST DAY"



ALLAH KNOWS BEST


SALAM

490

Prophets and Messengers / Re: Virgin Birth of Prophet Jesus PBUH

« on: June 26, 2013, 05:59:31 PM »

Salam

Thanks for sharing this discussion


when reading articles and discussions like this i believe it strengthens the readers ability to determine between the right and the wrong and it strengthens the ability of judgement if its with full honesty.

Thanks Joseph and others

491

Prophets and Messengers / Re: Difference between messengers and prophets?

« on: June 23, 2013, 02:59:38 PM »

Thanks QM Moderators team for your info and advice

I will wait inshallah for Joseph to look at this. When ever I guess he has time. No rush just thought it could be an interesting thought.

 I am currently reading many of his articles which I find very impressive. And I can almost say i understand his perspective on this kind of topic which I respect a lot and find very knowledgeable and helpful and honest.Thats why I would like to see his point of view on my opinion.  I also have read lots.

 Thanks for posting for the public. I appreciate it very much

Salam

Hamzeh

492

Prophets and Messengers / Re: Difference between messengers and prophets?

« on: June 22, 2013, 07:19:18 PM »

Salam

To when ever brother Joseph replies

I just wanted to correct something I said earlier about Gabriel.

As I just read another article on your website about Gabriel. whether he is an angel or not?

I just wanted to point out that from Surah 81 ayah 19 is where i am thinking he can be claimed as a messenger of ALLAH(swt). But Im not fimiliar with arabic grammer or literature. Im reading the transliteration and pointing it out from there. So i could be making a mistake.

And from your article about Gabriel being an angel or not, I have not yet verified it completely for myself. But to me if thats the case it can change a lot of other ideas I also had. Thanks so much for uncovering many ideas. Its amazing how much we can learn from one another. Allah Bless us all inshallah with true knowledge.

Thank you

493

General Discussions / Re: some questions regarding beliefs and practices

« on: June 20, 2013, 08:12:35 PM »

Salam

one more thing i forgot to mention was

40:78
And indeed We already sent Messengers even before you. Among them are the ones whom We related to you, and (some) We have not related to you; and in no way (could) any Messenger come up with a sign except by the permission of Allah. Then when the Command of Allah comes, (their end) is decreed with the Truth, and there over the wrong-doers (Literally: doers of void "deeds") will lose.

04:164
And Messengers We have mentioned to you before, and Messengers We have not mentioned to you, - and to Musa (Moses) Allah spoke directly.

494

General Discussions / Re: some questions regarding beliefs and practices

« on: June 20, 2013, 07:26:46 PM »

Salam Truth seeker

Just pondering about your comment and the ayat that you quoted to Adil.


3.65
O People of the Scripture! Why will ye argue about Abraham, when the Torah and the Gospel were not revealed till after him ?

To me this sounds like Its referring to the people of the scripture of course to a people who were after Abraham who had the Torah and the Gospel. So to me this is referring to the jews and the christians.


Now for Adil I think what you are trying to say is maybe that these other religions also started out as the same religion of islam but maybe changed and started to be organized like every other Abrahamic religion. Like you see in Islam Christianity and Judism there is so many sects and organizations. I heard that Hinduism was one of the oldest organized religions. But that was just coming from the speeches of others and i really didn't verify that.

But from the quran we know that:

026.105
“The people of Noah rejected the messengers”
 
 
025:037
“And the people of Noah, when they rejected the messengers, We drowned them and We made them as a Sign for mankind and We have prepared for (all) wrong-doers a grievous Penalty”
 
 
026.123
“The Ad (people) rejected the messengers”
 
026.141
“The Thamud (people) rejected the messengers”
 
026.160
“The people of Lut rejected the messengers”
 
026.176
"The Companions of the Wood rejected the messengers"

where all these people and companions all arabs or jews or christians? or
just maybe that hindus or Buddhists or sikhs or other nations that have there religions derived from one of these people who were sent as messengers.


And as you stated Adil


4:41 How is it then when We bring forth from every nation a witness, and bring you as a witness over these?

10:47 And for every nation is a messenger; so when their messenger comes, the matter is decreed between them with justice, and they are not wronged.

16:36 And We have sent a messenger to every nation:......


from the above verses the witness is got to be a messenger

and the day that its talking about is the day of judgment

And those people quoted above in those ayat are going to have witnesses on the day of judgement which are there messengers.

The witness that is going to be brought forth on the day of judgment, is going to be a messenger who is a witness over his people.

So in my opinion it might not be a messenger that would come after Muhammad(swt). As he is the final witness to witness if the people lived by the quran and used it as a way of life and believed in it. Because he is a witness for the whole world, (I know some will argue that he came to only the people of quraaysh) but to me that doesn't make sense because its encouraged that all people believe in the Quran and to judge by it and hold it to be true till the end of times.

So that means that maybe many nations have been brought the truth before and they rejected. And for everyone to seek the truth is not to blindly follow there forefathers religion but to always criticize it and to look for faults to see if its a holy and perfect religion that remained constant from the beginning of time till the end. and to trace its roots and to see what it says and see a pattern from one messenger to the other and till inshallah one day Allah(swt) will guide he/she.

And sorry to anyone for being interrupted by my comment. Im new to register on the website. Im not sure if im allowed to reply just on anyone. because some forums i notice i cant reply

Salam

495

Prophets and Messengers / Re: Difference between messengers and prophets?

« on: June 20, 2013, 09:19:30 AM »

Salam truth seeker

Thank you for the quick response.

I have read those articles you mentioned
And also aware of the part where Allah mentions the children of adam and that its referring to all people at all times.

I hope Joseph could read what I wrote and let me know what he thinks

Thank you so much look forward to reading more

Salam

Hamzeh