Messages

[I may, in due course and upon proper reexamination, retract some of the conclusions I previously presented, if I find that they are wrong. If they are, I have no problem amending them. I will only engage in discussion regarding posts that are Islam-related, because some of them will not be. I have also attempted to make some things abundantly clear: Although I will reblog things from other people's websites, I do not support everything they promote. And just because I like someone does not mean I will defend all of their positions, if I find them to be illogical.]

Peace Amira.
I like what you say here,quote:

I may, in due course and upon proper reexamination, retract some of the conclusions I previously presented, if I find that they are wrong. If they are, I have no problem amending them. I will only engage in discussion regarding posts that are Islam-related, because some of them will not be. I have also attempted to make some things abundantly clear: Although I will reblog things from other people's websites, I do not support everything they promote. And just because I like someone does not mean I will defend all of their positions, if I find them to be illogical.

This is mature just and wise.
May the Lord bless you and teach you His truth.
Peace

[16:101When we substitute one Ayat( revelation) in place of another, and God is fully aware of what He reveals, they say, "You made this up!" Indeed, most of them do not know.وَإِذا بَدَّلنا ءايَةً مَكانَ ءايَةٍ وَاللَّهُ أَعلَمُ بِما يُنَزِّلُ قالوا إِنَّما أَنتَ مُفتَرٍ بَل أَكثَرُهُم لا يَعلَمونَ 16:102Say, "The Holy Spirit has brought it down from your Lord, truthfully, to assure those who believe, and to provide a beacon and good news for the Muslimeen."قُل نَزَّلَهُ روحُ القُدُسِ مِن رَبِّكَ بِالحَقِّ لِيُثَبِّتَ الَّذينَ ءامَنوا وَهُدًى وَبُشرىٰ لِلمُسلِمينَ]

Peace brothers and sisters.
God does replace/substitute one "Ayat" with another. i.e one  scripture /revelation with another. For example,here :
16:101
When we substitute one Ayat( revelation) in place of another, and God is fully aware of what He reveals, they say, "You made this up!" Indeed, most of them do not know.
وَإِذا بَدَّلنا ءايَةً مَكانَ ءايَةٍ وَاللَّهُ أَعلَمُ بِما يُنَزِّلُ قالوا إِنَّما أَنتَ مُفتَرٍ بَل أَكثَرُهُم لا يَعلَمونَ
16:102
Say, "The Holy Spirit has brought it down from your Lord, truthfully, to assure those who believe, and to provide a beacon and good news for the Muslimeen."
قُل نَزَّلَهُ روحُ القُدُسِ مِن رَبِّكَ بِالحَقِّ لِيُثَبِّتَ الَّذينَ ءامَنوا وَهُدًى وَبُشرىٰ لِلمُسلِمينَ


Yes, GOD "knows what He reveals". He is consistent with His words .They confirm each other. He endorses His words only
On the other hand men s words have "Fabrications/ False doctrines/ Contradictions/Nonsense...etc" in them. GOD s words only contain truth 
i.e The words of the men who come across GOD s revelation and do not really believe GOD and do this:

16:105
The only ones who fabricate false doctrines are those who do not believe in God's revelations; they are the real liars.
إِنَّما يَفتَرِى الكَذِبَ الَّذينَ لا يُؤمِنونَ بِـٔايٰتِ اللَّهِ وَأُولٰئِكَ هُمُ الكٰذِبونَ

Throughout Qoran GOD is saying this new "revelation" contains the details of everything/confirms everything before it...etc. GOD expects all the believers( Jews/Christians/Muslims/...) to believe His words. i.e To believe Him.

16:104
Surely, those who do not believe in God's revelations, God does not guide them. They have incurred a painful retribution.
إِنَّ الَّذينَ لا يُؤمِنونَ بِـٔايٰتِ اللَّهِ لا يَهديهِمُ اللَّهُ وَلَهُم عَذابٌ أَليمٌ

Throughout my conversations with those who say they have given me verses that confirm "the bible", I found the verses given to me only confirming GOD s words from the bible. GOD has been consistent with this. For example:

32:23 And certainly We gave Moses the Scripture, so do not be in doubt encountering it (Arabic: liqaihi) and We made it a guide for the Children of Israel

Here GOD starts the verse with "We gave ..." No doubt whatsoever that it is "GOD Swords only".
I am not against the bible , I study the bible continuously as well as Qoran.
I am saying GOD only endorses/confirms...His words. He does not endorse men s words, wherever they may be.
I have no doubt the bible contains both . I give it the utmost respect and GOD guides with it also
Also. I do not find "Circumcision in Qoran.
GOD bless.
Peace.

[5:15O people of the scripture, our messenger( The Qoran) has come to you to proclaim for you many things you have concealed in the scripture, and to pardon many other transgressions you have committed. A beacon has come to you from God, and a profound scripture ( The Qoran).يٰأَهلَ الكِتٰبِ قَد جاءَكُم رَسولُنا يُبَيِّنُ لَكُم كَثيرًا مِمّا كُنتُم تُخفونَ مِنَ الكِتٰبِ وَيَعفوا عَن كَثيرٍ قَد جاءَكُم مِنَ اللَّهِ نورٌ وَكِتٰبٌ مُبينٌ 5:16With it( The Qoran), God guides those who seek His approval. He guides them to the paths of peace, leads them out of darkness into the light by His leave, and guides them in a straight path.يَهدى بِهِ اللَّهُ مَنِ اتَّبَعَ رِضوٰنَهُ سُبُلَ السَّلٰمِ وَيُخرِجُهُم مِنَ الظُّلُمٰتِ إِلَى النّورِ بِإِذنِهِ وَيَهديهِم إِلىٰ صِرٰطٍ مُستَقيمٍ]

Peace brother Joseph.
I am sure you would agree ,since Qoran s Arabic is absolutely clear,that GOD is saying to the Jews" You have taken words out of context2 and " you have  written your own words and claimed they are from GOD"...( 5:13,2:79)
You also would agree that GOD is similarly saying to the Christians " They will differ/become enemies/sects and disregard what they were reminded by GOD".(5:14) .
GOD is also making it absolutely clear to both to follow His messenger(Qoran):

5:15
O people of the scripture, our messenger( The Qoran) has come to you to proclaim for you many things you have concealed in the scripture, and to pardon many other transgressions you have committed. A beacon has come to you from God, and a profound scripture ( The Qoran).
يٰأَهلَ الكِتٰبِ قَد جاءَكُم رَسولُنا يُبَيِّنُ لَكُم كَثيرًا مِمّا كُنتُم تُخفونَ مِنَ الكِتٰبِ وَيَعفوا عَن كَثيرٍ قَد جاءَكُم مِنَ اللَّهِ نورٌ وَكِتٰبٌ مُبينٌ
5:16
With it( The Qoran), God guides those who seek His approval. He guides them to the paths of peace, leads them out of darkness into the light by His leave, and guides them in a straight path.
يَهدى بِهِ اللَّهُ مَنِ اتَّبَعَ رِضوٰنَهُ سُبُلَ السَّلٰمِ وَيُخرِجُهُم مِنَ الظُّلُمٰتِ إِلَى النّورِ بِإِذنِهِ وَيَهديهِم إِلىٰ صِرٰطٍ مُستَقيمٍ


This in my opinion is crystal clear to all "Ahla Al-Kitab".
However ,if one says Qoran is asking them to refer to "What is with them" i.e "Bible that existed at the time of the prophet",  then I disagree.
GOD is clear and deliberate in the verses to them to follow Torah and Injeel, that "HE sent down"that existed at the time of the prophet.i.e Only His words.
On the other hand  ,if one is to follow/refer to.. the bible,then Qoran should be used as a criteria ,just the same as it would have been used at the time of the prophet.

GOD is clear and consistent. Only His words must be the authority.
GOD bless you.
Peace.

[So don't you think the Quran is expecting the people who come in contact with the Quran to check some of their stories by the Bible?]

Peace Duster.
You say ,quote:
So don't you think the Quran is expecting the people who come in contact with the Quran to check some of their stories by the Bible?

GOD is addressing "Beni  Israeel" in 2:98. They are expected to know. To the rest it is irrelevant. Knowing about Michael has nothing to do with the Deen/message.
You already know ,from our last discussion, that I have clarified my understanding about the bible. It contains both GOD s words and men s words.Hence GOD is expecting them to know from "his words/ scripture" to them.i.e Torah.
GOD bless you.
Peace.

[Qoran confirms all, details all,answers all the questions that one needs to ask about the "one religion" / the deen/message..."Inna Hada Al-Qoran Yakussu Ala Beni Israeel Akthar Alladi Hum Feehi Yakhtalifoon"]

Peace Duster.
If you are asking me where you find information about Michael in the scriptures then try here:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_(archangel)

If you are asking my opinion or my understanding then Michael like Gabriel ,Angels... are GOD s  creation that do their duty for Him,like we should.

Other than that we are not given any details apart from what is in the scriptures. Therefore we only require details about our salvation hence what I said quote:
Qoran confirms all, details all,answers all the questions that one needs to ask about the "one religion" / the deen/message...
"Inna Hada Al-Qoran Yakussu Ala Beni Israeel Akthar Alladi Hum Feehi Yakhtalifoon"
Hence what we do not require to know in detail as part of the trial-i.e it is not required for our salvation- is not given to us.
So have a look at the sources and conclude your understanding from them as you are entitled to do so.

If you are implying Qoran refer us to the bible for more detail, then I disagree with you,Qoran is fully detailed..
Qoran advises us to get ",the best from all sources".
Thank you for the query.
GOD bless you.
Peace.

[5:15O people of the scripture, our messenger( The Qoran) has come to you to proclaim for you many things you have concealed in the scripture, and to pardon many other transgressions you have committed. A beacon has come to you from God, and a profound scripture ( The Qoran).يٰأَهلَ الكِتٰبِ قَد جاءَكُم رَسولُنا يُبَيِّنُ لَكُم كَثيرًا مِمّا كُنتُم تُخفونَ مِنَ الكِتٰبِ وَيَعفوا عَن كَثيرٍ قَد جاءَكُم مِنَ اللَّهِ نورٌ وَكِتٰبٌ مُبينٌ 5:16With it( The Qoran), God guides those who seek His approval. He guides them to the paths of peace, leads them out of darkness into the light by His leave, and guides them in a straight path.يَهدى بِهِ اللَّهُ مَنِ اتَّبَعَ رِضوٰنَهُ سُبُلَ السَّلٰمِ وَيُخرِجُهُم مِنَ الظُّلُمٰتِ إِلَى النّورِ بِإِذنِهِ وَيَهديهِم إِلىٰ صِرٰطٍ مُستَقيمٍ]

Peace Student.

I believe you are doing the right thing. You are finding out for yourself by yourself while navigating / "choosing what is best" among what is out there.The studying has to be done of all what is being claimed as scriptures out there.

There is no  other way or  short cut.

GOD on the other hand has not left us without answers. We are so lucky,the generations that came after Qoran. Jews, Christians, Muslims...etc GOD is addressing -The Jews and Christians-and all "People of the book" Anyone who  claims they have a scripture from GOD:

Yes indeed  a message/scripture/guide/....To the Jews and Christians and Muslims and....

5:15
O people of the scripture, our messenger( The Qoran) has come to you to proclaim for you many things you have concealed in the scripture, and to pardon many other transgressions you have committed. A beacon has come to you from God, and a profound scripture ( The Qoran).
يٰأَهلَ الكِتٰبِ قَد جاءَكُم رَسولُنا يُبَيِّنُ لَكُم كَثيرًا مِمّا كُنتُم تُخفونَ مِنَ الكِتٰبِ وَيَعفوا عَن كَثيرٍ قَد جاءَكُم مِنَ اللَّهِ نورٌ وَكِتٰبٌ مُبينٌ
5:16
With it( The Qoran), God guides those who seek His approval. He guides them to the paths of peace, leads them out of darkness into the light by His leave, and guides them in a straight path.
يَهدى بِهِ اللَّهُ مَنِ اتَّبَعَ رِضوٰنَهُ سُبُلَ السَّلٰمِ وَيُخرِجُهُم مِنَ الظُّلُمٰتِ إِلَى النّورِ بِإِذنِهِ وَيَهديهِم إِلىٰ صِرٰطٍ مُستَقيمٍ

Qoran confirms all, details all,answers all the questions that one needs to ask about the "one religion" / the deen/message...
"Inna Hada Al-Qoran Yakussu Ala Beni Israeel Akthar Alladi Hum Feehi Yakhtalifoon"
GOD bless you.
Peace

[37:104We called him: "O Abraham.وَنٰدَينٰهُ أَن يٰإِبرٰهيمُ 37:105"You have believed the dream." We thus reward the righteous.قَد صَدَّقتَ الرُّءيا إِنّا كَذٰلِكَ نَجزِى المُحسِنينَ 37:106That was an exacting test indeed.إِنَّ هٰذا لَهُوَ البَلٰؤُا۟ المُبينُ]

Peace F.

Thank you for your reply.
Let us take the verses you quoted and see whether they have anything to do with GOD commanding/ordering/asking ...Abraham to sacrifice his son?

2:124: The context of this verse is explained in the following verses-2:125-132- i.e commands about the "rites of the millat/deen". Nothing to do with sacrificing a son!!!!

37:106: Please read the verses of the incident again. Nowhere does GOD say it was a test from Him?Do you think GOD tests people by asking them to break His commandments? :

37:104
We called him: "O Abraham.
وَنٰدَينٰهُ أَن يٰإِبرٰهيمُ
37:105
"You have believed the dream." We thus reward the righteous.
قَد صَدَّقتَ الرُّءيا إِنّا كَذٰلِكَ نَجزِى المُحسِنينَ
37:106
That was an exacting test indeed.
إِنَّ هٰذا لَهُوَ البَلٰؤُا۟ المُبينُ
GOD is saying to Abraham "you have believed the dream". Abraham assumed /thought ...that he was ordered/...GOD then said "it was a test" ,not a test from GOD? If anything GOD saved him from carrying it  out because Abraham was loyal to GOD. GOD saves His devoted servants like in the case of Joseph here:
12:24
...We thus diverted evil and sin away from him, for he was one of our devoted servants.

Brother you are assuming that the test/command was from Allah! It does not say it in the verses you quoted. and does not say it in Qoran.
GOD bless you.
Peace.

Peace Duster.

No, we are not discussing whether the bible contains GOD s words, I have already answered this. I have already said there is both GOD s words and men s word in the present bible.
We are discussing whether GOD is asking them to judge by "the bible that exists now as a whole". I am saying GOD is not doing that.
GOD is clear, precise and deliberate. He is asking them to follow/judge by only what "He revealed" in it.

I am clear in what I am saying.
Now, are you saying GOD is asking them to  judge by everything that is in the bible as we have it?

If you are, then I disagree with you.
GOD bless you.
Peace.

[Simple verses and you deny them. This all started with you not willing to accept that the Quran refers people of the Book to judge by other than the Quran with clear references to Biblical scriptures .......you've tried to do symantic twisting but it has not worked. Whether it was a waste of time.....I'll let other readers decide...]

Peace duster.
You say,quote:
Simple verses and you deny them. This all started with you not willing to accept that the Quran refers people of the Book to judge by other than the Quran with clear references to Biblical scriptures .......you've tried to do symantic twisting but it has not worked.   Whether it was a waste of time.....I'll let other readers decide...

The simple verses of Qoran have clear references to "What GOD has revealed" only in what you call those biblical scriptures.
Brother we discussed this same issue here:

Peace Duster.

GOD is clear in all those verses ,. Each of the verse or  context highlights "What GOD has revealed" . So GOD is consistent in all His scripture . To follow only what GOD has revealed. i.e The words of GOD.

If you are saying to me the "bible" we have contains only the words of GOD, then I disagree with you. The same with the books that existed when Mohammed was sent. they had GOD s words and men s words in them. GOD is saying to them "Follow His words only"!.

Peace relearning;

5:68 has  added " and all the revelations that come to you from your Lord"- Only GOD s words-.

5:43,...46

GOD is again confirming  "The Torah that had come before Jesus" and "We sent him the Gospel" ...Both GOD s words only.

5:47  makes it clear-  Judge by what GOD has revealed"  GOD s words only.

Hope you can see GOD s consistency clearer now.

GOD knows human and jinn devils will write their own words and claim it is from GOD!!!!

So when it comes to the "bible"  Qoran confirms ( GOD s words) and  rejects the rest. Same as what was asked from people of the book at the time of Mohammed.
Thank you .
GOD bless you.
Peace.

Peace Duster.
You are not reading my posts.
I said all along the bible contains GOD s words and men s words.
May be you ought to read my posts again. You are not making sense or may be you run out of things to say to me.Or does this mean you are admitting that the bible contains men s words also?

Brother, shall I repeat myself once more:
GOD has asked the people of the book to follow/judge by His words only.
Thank you.
GOD bless you.
Peace.

Peace Duster.

May be this is clearer to you:
The parts that GOD has sent down. ,for example what GOD sent to Moses , David,Solomon and the prophets to beni Israeel, and what was sent  to Jesus.   Yes ,GOD s words can be found in the bible.
However other books can also be found in the bible,.
What GOD has revealed is also confirmed in Qoran. Since you believe Qoran, check for yourself. All the verses you mentioned have" what GOD has revealed or "What GOD has sent down" to emphasise the point that "Only GOD s words " are to  be followed/judged by"

Anyway, I am repeating myself, If you do not get my point, show me otherwise from Qoran.

GOD bless you.
Peace.

Peace Duster.
You follow judge by the bible if you wish. My answer to you is this:
The parts that "GOD has revealed".
Those who study the bible and are sincere, GOD will guide them to His words.
You me and everyone else,need to study/ponder GOD s scriptures . GOD Alone is the guide.
Here is the criteria  :

1. RATIONAL TEACHINGS: Since God bestowed reason and intellect on mankind, it is our duty to use it to distinguish truth from falsehood. True undistorted revelation from God must be rational and can be reasoned out by all unbiased minds.

2. PERFECTION: Since God is all perfect, His revelation must be perfect and accurate, free from mistakes, omissions, interpolations and multiplicity of versions. It should be free from contradictions in its narration.

3. NO MYTHS OR SUPERSTITIONS: True revelation from God is free from myths or superstitions that degrade the dignity of God or man.

4. SCIENTIFIC: Since God is the Creator of all knowledge, true revelation is scientific and can with stand the challenge of science at all times.

5. PROPHECY: God is the Knower of the past, present and future. Thus His word of prophecies in His revelation will be fulfilled as prophesied.

6. INIMITABLE BY MAN: True revelation from God is infallible and cannot be imitated by man. God's true revelation is a Living miracle, an open Book challenging all mankind to see and prove for themselves.

The checking/confirming is yours.

GOD bless you.
Peace.

Peace Duster.

The bible we have today is a mixture of books. GOD s words and men s words
I have always maintained that GOD asked the people of the book to follow/judge by "What GOD has revealed" in it.not all of the bible.
SO, where is the backtracking?

The bible we have today and mohammed had in his time contains GOD s words and men s words. The parts that are GOD s words is what GOD  is asking the people of the book to follow/judge by.

I have been consistent with this theme throughout my posts.

GOD chooses His words carefully and precisely.

Thank you brother.
GOD bless you

Peace Nura.

I say peace to you.
GOD bless you.

Peace Duster.

Show me where I said Torah, Injeel, zaboor... are not part of the bible.  I was discussing all of the bible.

You are making the wrong assumption,yet again.

The verses you showed me confirm what I said. i.e To follow/judge by "What GOD has revealed" only.
Do you still insist it is all of the bible?

GOD bless you.
Peace.