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Offline Talib

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1000/3000/5000 angels ?
« on: November 09, 2012, 06:50:00 PM »
Dear All

Salamun Alaikum

I wish for you all to be at your superbest !

I would like to have your understanding about the following number of Angels in the verses and how can we understand the message in these verses w/o the use of Secondary sources (say history or ahadith)

Y. Ali

8/9
Remember ye implored the assistance of your Lord, and He answered you: "I will assist you with a thousand of the angels, ranks on ranks."

3/124
Remember thou saidst to the Faithful: "Is it not enough for you that Allah should help you with three thousand angels (Specially) sent down?

3/125
"Yea, - if ye remain firm, and act aright, even if the enemy should rush here on you in hot haste, your Lord would help you with five thousand angels Making a terrific onslaught.



Some people assert that these are referring to the War battles and that Allah helped the believers with Angels. They say that if we do not accept Secondary sources as books of guidance then we cannot understand these verses.

What is the proper understanding of these from Quran alone ?


I found in verse 41/30 that the angels descend on those who believe firmly that Our Lord is Allah.

In the case of those who say, "Our Lord is Allah", and, further, stand straight and steadfast, the angels descend on them (from time to time): "Fear ye not!" (they suggest), "Nor grieve! but receive the Glad Tidings of the Garden (of Bliss), the which ye were promised!


I firmly believe in Allah, since years, but never met a single angel yet ! :)

So what they say, should not be the proper understanding. Please enlighten.


Thank you

Regards



PS:
I tried to search if the question is already covered but could not find anything really. Any assistance with reference to links etc would be appreciated.

Offline HOPE

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Re: 1000/3000/5000 angels ?
« Reply #1 on: November 10, 2012, 05:01:06 AM »
Dear  Talib,

Quote
I firmly believe in Allah, since years, but never met a single angel yet

You do not know that.

My understanding of 41:30 is that those who say Our Rabb is Allah and stand firm in their faith, the malaks, instead of the devils mentioned in the previous verse, descend upon them to make their faith firmer and inspire them to do good deeds.  All other verses should be understood in this light.  The number of malaks is irrelevant.
"Hope is like a bird that senses the dawn and carefully starts to sing while it is still dark"

Offline HOPE

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Re: 1000/3000/5000 angels ?
« Reply #2 on: November 10, 2012, 07:30:14 AM »
Salaam Talib,

8:9 is a beautiful reminder that  help comes from Him alone.  Apparently, the prophet implored God's assistance and He responds by strengthening the hearts of maybe 1000 believers with the prophet as can be seen in the next verse  and 8:12 shows that terror is cast into the hearts of the disbelievers in contrast to the tranquillity cast on the believers.

"Hope is like a bird that senses the dawn and carefully starts to sing while it is still dark"