Messages

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General Discussions / Re: Critique - DOES THE QURAN ALLOW ... DOGS, CATS, RATS ETC? by Arman Aziz

« on: March 03, 2014, 09:35:07 AM »

Salamun Alaikum.

Repeat your arguments and fancies as many time you like... make new rules, give new fatwas, start a new sect if that's what you want... but for me the words of my Master will remain adequate. In sha Allah I will eat from the delicious foods Our Master has provided us and will appreciate His blessings as long as I can - because He is the One I am slave to. You can bully me but you cannot change the words of my Master.

Surah Al-An-am (Grazing Livestock); Verses 145-147

6:145   Say, “I do not find in what has been inspired to me anything prohibited to an eater who eats – except – that it happens to be dead, or poured-out blood or flesh of swine; then indeed it is pollution or willful disobedience originating for other than Allah with it.” Then whoever is compelled - neither coveting nor recurring; then indeed your Master is Relenting, Kind.

6:146   And upon those who are Yahudi We prohibited every (creature) with claws; and of the cows and the sheep We prohibited upon them their fat/lipid  except what carried their backs or their entrails or whatever is joined with the bones – that is their repayment for their envious acts. And indeed We surely are sincere.

6:147   Then if they deny you then say, “Your Master is vastly full of mercy but His pressure will not turn away from a criminal people.”

[Please cross check translation. Emphasis added.]

May Allah guide us all to the straight route.

Till our paths meet again ... Fee Amanillah.

Arman

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General Discussions / Re: Critique - DOES THE QURAN ALLOW ... DOGS, CATS, RATS ETC? by Arman Aziz

« on: February 28, 2014, 10:01:19 AM »

Salamun Alaikum.

Most of us who try to find the true message of Qur'an tend to agree that veiling the head and face of women is not a "mandatory" requirement in Qur'an. Now think of a respectful old lady who has spent her entire life behind the veil to please Allah believing that is what Allah wants from her. When she would be presented with the conclusion that face/head veiling is not mandatory - she will find this a "Monstrous Crazy" analysis which is bound to destroy the very fabric of our society  - because after spending a lifetime within a certain prejudice her ability of looking objectively beyond her deeply held conviction would be shaken. So, even when she is presented with clear verses from Qur'an she will see in the verse only what she wants to see OR has been taught to see.

When it comes to dietary laws - almost all of us are in a position similar to that of the respected old lady. Our prejudices on this matter are so deep that we comfortably overrule crystal clear verses (like 6:145) and ironically insist to call ourselves "Quran-centric" etc.

There are communities in this world who eat dogs, there are others who eat horses. Sharks and frogs are part of regular diet for billions of people in China and Japan. In the large forest areas there are tribal people who live on all sorts of wild animals. We have become so blind-sighted in our prejudices that we believe these people are acting beyond their human nature - in other words we consider them sub-human - Allah does not bless them, nor their food - as if they are surviving for generations based on mercy of devil! This is a sorry pathetic state of our community. 

May Allah guide us all to the straight route.

Regards,

Arman

3

Prophets and Messengers / Re: Joseph Islam's Article "EXCLUSIVENESS OF PROPHET MUHAMMAD (pbuh)"

« on: February 27, 2014, 01:50:11 PM »

Dear Brother Joseph:

Salam. Thanks again for your comments. I now see where you are coming from. If you are convinced 2:253 is talking about ranks in hereafter - I will not insist to claim you wrong - this is simply another way of understanding the verse - Allah knows best what He wanted to mean - we merely try to follow the best meaning that appeals to our reason and understanding. I do agree with you that all messengers were higher in rank than their counterparties - while some were so because Allah talked with him or strengthened him with Holy Spirit; others were so because Allah simply made them higher in rank in wisdom / leadership skill / character attributes etc.

The only reason I am posting again is - it seemed to me the translation of the verse 17:21 that you provided is a bit off-the-norm. Most familiar translators* seem to imply that the hereafter itself is in higher rank (than this life) rather than there are higher ranks "in the hereafter". From the structure of the arabic text "wa lalakhiratu akbaru darajatin" that seems to be the more acceptable translation.

*Reference: http://corpus.quran.com/translation.jsp?chapter=17&verse=21

May Allah guide us all to the straight route.

Best regards,

Arman

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Prophets and Messengers / Re: Joseph Islam's Article "EXCLUSIVENESS OF PROPHET MUHAMMAD (pbuh)"

« on: February 27, 2014, 10:20:06 AM »

Dear Brother Joseph:

Salamun Alaikum.

Thanks for your nice and detailed explanation for your understanding. I fully accept your conclusion that the messengers were only humans and it is fully supportable from Quranic perspective that Allah will even judge the messengers based on their individual performance. This does not contradict in any way to directive of not differentiating among the messengers.

However, I am not convinced that this "evaluation of performance" is same as the "raising of ranks" mentioned in verse 2:253. The verse explicitly says Allah graced the messengers - some over others - and then as examples of His varying degree of grace to the messengers he mentions 3 cases - a) He spoke with some; b) He raised some in ranks and c) He gave Jesus, son of Mary, clear proofs and supported him with the Holy Spirit. It is quite obvious to me, from the overall essence of the verse, that these examples are supposed to be graces that messengers received in this world to carry out their duties - not their relative evaluation in the afterlife. From this perspective the point b) above only seems to mean that some messengers were raised in rank from their contemporaries - not necessarily from other messengers.

If someone assumes from the verse that some messengers were raised in rank from other messengers as a grace from Allah - from even before they executed their duties - that has problematic implications. On this basis, it is often asserted in traditional tafsir that the above verse implies Prophet Muhammahd was in a higher rank than Moses (with whom Allah spoke) and Jesus (mentioned by name in the verse) - peace upon all. I believe such an interpretation is rather weak and contradictory to the spirit of 2:285.

Anyways, the key takeaway for the believers is that we must NOT differentiate among the messengers. Since we are agreeing on the key point the remaining difference (if any) in understanding or interpretation is rather trivial.

Thanks to brother Hamzeh, too, for his beautiful and insightful post.

May Allah guide us all to the straight route.

Regards,
Arman

5

Islamic Duties / Allah's names vs. human names

« on: February 26, 2014, 11:46:48 AM »

Dear All:

Salamun Alaikum.

I had an interesting discussion with brother Sardar on another post which prompted me to raise this topic separately. I have been suggested that my last name being one of 99 names of Allah may be problematic to be used, without the prefix "Abdul-", as a human name.

From my reading of Al Qur'an I have not come across any verse which would indicate that certain names are exclusively reserved for Allah and cannot be used as human name. Rather from verses like 9:128 it seems that words like Aziz, Rahim etc. can be used to qualify a human being.

My humble understanding is there are - not 99 - rather thousands of different names of Allah in thousands of different languages. There are certain name like Allah, Elohim, God etc. in different language - which are exclusively used to refer to Allah / God in that particular language. It would be linguistically incorrect to use these terms as human name. But otherwise there is no merit in claiming certain names are exclusively reserved for God. Nor is there any merit in saying that we commit "shirk" if we call someone Mr. Aziz or Mr. Rahman.

But I may be missing something here. Would anyone share your thoughts on this matter especially in light of Qur'an?

May Allah guide us all to the straight route.

Regards,
Arman

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General Discussions / Re: Hello from a Monotheist outside of Islam

« on: February 26, 2014, 09:18:12 AM »

Dear Brother Sardar:

Salamun Alaikum.

I am really sorry I misunderstood your posting. The term "A muslim is one who..." sounded like you are trying to define the term. If that was not the intension - please accept my apologies. But it doesn't harm to be a bit more careful about our word choices so that the readers do not misunderstand.

Regarding the term "Aziz", please check Al Qur'an 9:128 - you'll see the term has been used to describe the messenger of Allah. I do not believe there is anything wrong in my name. What our community is suffering is also grievous to me. Thanks for your concern though.

May Allah guide us all to the straight route.

Best regards,

Arman

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Prophets and Messengers / Re: Joseph Islam's Article "EXCLUSIVENESS OF PROPHET MUHAMMAD (pbuh)"

« on: February 25, 2014, 04:27:48 PM »

Salamun Alaikum.

With due respect to both of you - I would humbly suggest an alternate way of understanding verse 2:253 - which makes more sense to me. While Allah graced some messengers over others, the verse does not necessarily mean they had different ranks with Allah. I believe when Allah says, raising some messengers in rank - it is meaning raising them in rank above the contemporaries of the messenger - not other messengers of other people/generation.

Thus, the verse would effectively mean -  there were messengers with whom Allah communicated verbally (may or may not be through an angel) and there were / are / will be others who are messengers simply because God elevated them in rank over fellow humans - perhaps with superior wisdom and/or leadership qualities. Prophet Jesus mentioned separately in the verse would be in a special category where he was strengthened with the Holy Spirit. However irrespective of the mode of communication with Allah - in which He may have graced some over others per His will - they are all messengers of Allah (to be revered by us without any differentiation.)

I believe this is the more appropriate understanding of the verse because - if we take the verse to mean messengers to have varying ranks with Allah - that already, is in essence, contradictory to the directive of not differentiating among the messengers.

May Allah guide us all to the straight route.

Regards,
Arman

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General Discussions / Re: Hello from a Monotheist outside of Islam

« on: February 25, 2014, 09:22:37 AM »

Orthodox Muslims are not those who believe in Ahadiths but deviant from right path of Islam.A muslim is one who believes in Quran & leads his life as per teachings of Quran as Quran is Muffasil ( Detailed).No Hadith is needed to practice Islam.Regarding Prophet Jesus , he was as human as other prophets like Abraham,Ismail,Yaqoob and Musa. Allah is Unique and does not need a son to be His prophet.Prophet Jesus was neither crucified  nor it was needed for his ummah to get salvation.

Dear Brother Sardar:

Salamun Alaikum.

Let's be very careful when we "define" a certain term. If you carefully study Qur'an you'll see that the term "Muslim" applies to anyone who has surrendered to the will of Allah / One true GOD. Believing in Qur'an is not a "required" attribute for being a Muslim.

In this connection the following article by brother Joseph is quite insightful.

Muslim and Mu'min (Believer) - The Difference
http://quransmessage.com/articles/muslim%20mumin%20FM3.htm

May Allah guide us all to the straight route.

Best regards,
Arman

9

Islamic Duties / Re: Prohibition of pictures

« on: February 21, 2014, 10:33:04 AM »

Salamun Alaikum.

Thanks to brother Joseph for showing with the example of Prophet Solomon that the act of making a statue in itself is not a sin - in light of Qur'an. It may be also possible to draw similar conclusion from the making of shapes of birds with clay by Prophet Jesus.

Allah narrates the stories of Prophets to teach us. May Allah help us all pay attention.

Regards,
Arman

10

General Discussions / Re: Food dedictated to other deities instead of Allah

« on: February 20, 2014, 06:19:37 PM »

Dear Brother Optimist:

Salamun Alaikum.

Your disagreement with me duely noted. Let's agree to disagree and move ahead.
Thanks for your time to engage and discuss with me the issue with patience. I have really gained a lot of insight from the discussions.

May Allah guide us to the straight route.

Regards,
Arman

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General Discussions / Re: Food dedictated to other deities instead of Allah

« on: February 20, 2014, 09:41:37 AM »

Dear Brother Optimist:

Salamun Alaikum.

You have on one hand appreciated my argument skill and on the other hand saying you do not find in what I say "any logic at all". Usually if I do not find any logic in someone's statement I would not appreciate his argument skill - but then again how you and I eveluate logic and arguments may be different. Point noted.

I believe we both have reached the end of discussion here. You have summarized the focus of 6:119 with the following statement: "Actually the focus here is unnecessary restrictions imposed by people to eat what is declared Hal’al and over which Allah's name has been pronounced at the time of slaughter." I agree with you except for the last 5 words (pointed in red) - which I still feel is an unwarranted addition to what Allah is saying in these verses.

If you still insist to add these words (i.e. "at the time of slaughter") - the burden of proof is upon you to show from exact words of Qur'an where you get these. I know you will jump to 22:36 - but please show me the linkage - show me how 22:36 is supposed to be the only process to remember Allah over the meat we eat. Per my reading of the words of Qur'an (in 22:34) this is supposed to be a recommended ritual (manasikan) for our community (ummah), like rituals have been prescribed to other communities - not a general dietary rule. For Allah has clearly allowed us to eat from the food of selected other communities in Al-Quran 5:5. If you have concluded that the linkage has to be there because your imam / scholar / master has told you so - then I leave you with them and their deductions. Indeed I have faced my face to the One who framed the heavens and the earth in precision and I do not happen to be one associating partners with Him.

May Allah guide us all to the straight route.

Best regards,

Arman

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General Discussions / Re: Food dedictated to other deities instead of Allah

« on: February 19, 2014, 03:10:06 PM »

Wa alaikum as Salam, brother Optimist.

Yes I DO THINK that Quran is talking about a situation where someone NOT eating after he/she has already volundarily mentioned Allah's name before eating. You think such a situation is absurd? Not really - try looking in a mirror.

Like I would happily eat good meat coming from a "non-religious" slaughterhouse where they have the procedure to conduct the slaughter legitimately - after I have remembered Allah over it.

And why shouldn't I eat such meat over which I have personally ensured Allah's name has been remembered seeing that He has so clearly spelled out to us what He has forbidden us [to eat] unless we are compelled [to do so] in verse 2:173?

Apparently you would not eat such meat even if you have option to remember God over it, right? Can you then please explain why you would not eat such meat in light of 6:119? Only because Qur'an mentions it in passive voice - so you have concluded someone else has to do the remembering for you? Then if your doctor tell you not to eat uncooked meat - in passive voice - would you understand it is not sufficient that you cook it by yourself, rather someone else has to cook it for you?

Best regards,
Arman

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General Discussions / Re: Food dedictated to other deities instead of Allah

« on: February 19, 2014, 01:08:49 PM »

Dear Brother Optimist:

Wa alikum As Salam.

I do not understand why you keep on asking the same questions again and again. I have mentioned before that in verse 5:4 Allah has given the eaters the indemnity over what they eat as long as a) they eat good things, b) ensuring they are from a source who are taught the right process of animal slaughter and last but not least c) they remember Allah over it themselves. I am just emphasizing the point C here. Even if we are unsure of whether Allah's name was pronounced at the time of slaughter - as long as we remember Allah's name over our own food - we have done the required due diligence from our part and hence we are risk free. Please refer to verse 5:4 and then let me know if you are still not getting the point.

I know according to you there is sufficient reason for Allah to make it mandatory to mention Allah's name during slaughter. According to a vegetarian buddhist, there is even more sufficient reasons for God to make all animals prohibited (how can we kill for food!). According to a hindu there is sufficient reason for God to make cows prohibited (we drink cow's milk, they are like our mother!). But you know what - I don't care. All I care about is what Allah has really prohibited based on His exact words - not what He should have or could have prohibited. My Master does not run short of words. He could have said "do not eat the animals which have not been slaughtered in My name" - if that was the intension. But He chose not to do so to make our life easy. I am deeply and specifically grateful to Allah for this kind gesture. I will eat the good things that my Master has provided me and appreciate Him - because He is the one I am slave to - then if I make a mistake, I know my Master is Forgiving, Kind.

May Allah guide us all to the straight route.

Regards,
Arman

14

Islamic Duties / Re: Paying some extra amount while repaying the loan amount

« on: February 19, 2014, 11:22:19 AM »

Salamun Alaikum.

Al hmdu lillah. I am feeling Brother Optimist and I have finally reached an point where we can evaluate each others arguments rationally and amicably. For me that's already a big achievement. I am perfectly aware that what I am proposing is quite novel concept and challanges the predispositions that we as a community have been holding for thousands of years. So, I am not even dreaming that the readers of my post will right away agree with me when they read my post.
And I am totally open to the idea that my understanding may also not be perfect either and I could learn from someone in this forum.

So let's think and analyze and debate. Hopefully if we put effort to understand the verses of Allah - our Master will guide us all to the straight route.

Best regards,
Arman

15

General Discussions / Re: Food dedictated to other deities instead of Allah

« on: February 19, 2014, 11:01:27 AM »

Dear Brother Optimist:

Salamun Alaikum.

I have mentioned before and saying again - you are absolutely fee to understand the verses of Qur'an as per your own intellect. You are responsible for your understanding, and I am for mine. But, unfortunately you seem to be misrepresenting or misinterpreting what I am saying - which is not acceptable.  Below I am trying to rectify the misrepresentations that you have made about my position - the underlined sentences reflect your accusitions and what follows are my clarifications:

Your explanation suddenly makes it mandatory for us to mention Allah’s name before eating and it has a serious implication that we ignore the importance of mentioning Allah’s name during killing animals based on the belief that mentioning Allah’s name at the time of eating would be sufficient.

The above statement is incorrect at two levels:

1) I did not say it is mandatory to "mention" Allah's name before eating; I said it is mandatory to ensure Allah's name has been REMEMBERED over what we eat. - that's per my understanding of verses of Qur'an (6:118-121). Then additionally I deducted that, per my understanding, the only practical and risk-free way to adhere to this Qur'anic commandment is by remembering Allah over our own food ourselves. [If you know of a better way - take it.]

2) I did not ask to ignore the imprortance of mentioning Allah’s name during killing animals when we ourselves are engaged in the process of slaughtering - that is quite obviously encouraged in 22:36. All I am saying is, for a 'non-pork" meat which is otherwise expected to be acquired and processed in the prescribed legitimate manner (Al Qur'an 5:3), and not known to have been dedicated to anyone other than God either - whether or not God's name has been pronounced at the time of slaughter should not be the deciding factor in decreeing the meat as haram/halal. Because Allah has SPECIFICALLY given us the option of eating such meat by remembering Allah over it ourselves (Al Qur'an 5:4).

You want to eat from anywhere without caring who slaughtered the animals, whether it is dedicated to others or not.

I have always maintained and continue to maintain that if we have specific information that any food (be it meat, fish or vegetable) has been dedicated to other than Allah - it becomes Haram for us. Because eating such items could be viewed as our implicit support in the act and hence would be considered as a willful disobedience (fisk) on our part. In my country there are practices where so called "Muslims" dedicate animals at the shrine of dead priests with a hope that the dead priest would intercede for them with Allah. Na'usubillah - I do consider such practices and meat of such animals Haram. However, if we are compelled to eat such food without coveting or recurring any more than necessary then there is NO SIN IN IT - because our Master is Forgiving, Kind. (Al Qur'an 2:173)

But you got my intensions right that I want to make dietary rules as simple and easy as Allah has made it (Al Qur'an 5:93; 6:145). I have seen "Muslims" who would not eat anything except water and plain steamed rice in countries where they cannot find a "Halal Certified" restaurant. I sincerely believe this cannot be a correct method to appreciate the bounty of our Almighty Master. I do believe that our scholars and "imams" have made the dietary rules far more complicated and difficult than Qur'an prescribes it to be. I want to understand the real prohibitions of Qur'an so that I can freely try all the good things (tayyibat) that are not prohibited and then appreciate my Master for His mercy.

Dear brother - if you still have confusion about what I am concluding - then probably it is because of limitation of my communication ability. Given that, if you still accuse me of saying things which I did not say - I'll probably just ignore it.

May Allah guide us all to the straight route.

Regards,
Arman