Messages

496

General Discussions / Re: Q&A Blessings, Shaving the Head and Dhikr

« on: October 24, 2012, 03:48:52 AM »

salaam Joseph, all,

Question:

2) Haaj and shaving the head...
 
Again Joseph, I have read thru the article, what is the reason/wisdom behind the shaving (or shortening ) of the hair?

Answer:

Response to Question 2:

No reason is given by the Quran. Like the Tawaaf of Safa and Marwa, Arafat and the Sacred Monument, the shaving or cutting of the hair was a pre-jahaliyya rite of worship allowed to continue in the name of the One God as part of Hajj. [3]
http://quransmessage.com/articles/hajj%20FM3.htm

I agree that the above answer is perhaps the only answer one can give, as there is simply no reason given in Quran. But even if there is no reason, is it actually practical and logical? This we can ponder over...

Critical Question 1: if you (plural) are prevented from completing hajj/3umra, then how can you ensure the hady reaches its mahilla?
This simple question is commonly neglected by translators. There is variance amongst traditional commentators/jurists as to how to go about this, some say wherever you are sacrifice an animal and that is fine (which goes against the Arabic!) or some say send it but fail to explain how or with whom. If one translates it in such a way, however it gets there this should be explained by Quran itself, if so, the only words that could possibly explain this are: "do not HLQ your RAS". This in itself is strong evidence against the traditional translation of "do not shave your heads". Please note there is also variance when it comes to when to "shave your head" as the Arabic implies one can only do so when the HDY reaches its permitted place, but imagining a practical situation is difficult, i.e. the person sends HDY then waits then when someone (we dont know who) returns and tells them yes your HDY did reach where it was sent you may now shave your head they then do so on their say so.
Even if we were to accept these variant baseless explanations, translating it in the traditional way does not make any sense because having a adhan/hurt of head preventing head-shaving (e.g. cut, infection, surgery, sunburn, toupe, bald) does not actually prevent one giving a HDY/offering! It would be like Quran mentioning something irrelevant such as having a sore pinky finger thus instead of giving HDY do something else instead, when having a sore pinky finger is completely irrelevant to what is being discussed.
In addition, the traditional understanding also differentiates between those with and without hurt of the head for no obvious/practical reason, which is illogical. No commentary that I read explains this away. See here for brief explanation of this point. Critical Question 2.

Source for the above can be given upon request.

497

Resources and Information Portal / Project Root List - free app now available

« on: October 19, 2012, 12:24:46 AM »

salaam all,

Ever wanted to have a Quran dictionary, concordance and grammar resource with you wherever you went?
Well now you can, on your android phone or tablet:

FREE app: http://www.studyquran.org/resources/PRL.apk


Online version: http://www.studyquran.co.uk/PRLonline.htm

Courtesy of StudyQuran.org

498

Islamic Duties / Re: Is sacrifice of an animal by muslim who is not attending Hajj instructed in the Quran ?

« on: October 19, 2012, 12:08:35 AM »

salaam adil,

One of the verses likely in question would be 2:196.


The traditional understanding of this verse has many issues in my view, but on the point you enquire about, it seems relatively clear.

499

General Discussions / Re: Translation without interpretation

« on: October 17, 2012, 03:05:50 AM »

salaam sardar,

Secondly you have suggested to check the cross reference of Ayaat which is difficult for a new comer to find out. Some time back I requested several people on various Forums to guide me or give reference of any book which highlight such references (Tasreef ) but I could not get help. I am trying to learn Quranic Arabic to understand myself by referring various books though some organizations would teach Arabic and Transliteration on line. Your kind suggestion in this regard will be appreciated. Thanks

The following site contains many excellent links: www.StudyQuran.org

500

General Discussions / Re: Translation without interpretation

« on: October 17, 2012, 03:04:47 AM »

salaam,

Are you working on translating Quran without interpretation?

I dont think such a thing is possible. All translations will have some interpretation.

501

General Discussions / Re: 5:55

« on: October 17, 2012, 03:02:24 AM »

w/salaam,

Ahh, I never noticed that. I would assume it is determined by what is said in the verse, however I am not sure how accurate the corpus tagging is with regard to that. There are many other examples according to corpus, e.g.

http://corpus.quran.com/wordmorphology.jsp?location=(2:8:9)

http://corpus.quran.com/wordmorphology.jsp?location=(8:5:7)

http://corpus.quran.com/wordmorphology.jsp?location=(6:161:13)

http://corpus.quran.com/wordmorphology.jsp?location=(3:65:7)

http://corpus.quran.com/wordmorphology.jsp?location=(9:56:5)

etc etc.

Corpus seems to suggest "while". I have no problem with "while" or simply "and". It would be interesting to see if there was a pattern in the usage, but this would likely involve studying hundreds of occurrences.

502

General Discussions / Re: 5:55

« on: October 15, 2012, 07:02:59 PM »

w/salaam,

Background: http://corpus.quran.com/wordbyword.jsp?chapter=5&verse=55#(5:55:1)

The Arabic literally says "and they are those who RK3"

RK3 can mean bow, incline, (are)humble.

503

General Discussions / Re: Why should we face towards the Kaaba(mecca) while praying ?

« on: October 12, 2012, 04:42:12 PM »

w/salaam saba,

Thanks for your response. Actually, the common claim is that it is a physical mark (which you seem to agree with). I posted an alternative to the common claim. Ideally, the evidence is put on the table for each option, then weighed. If you prefer not to answer my questions, thats is your choice.


w/salaam hope,

Thanks for your input. The only thing I would correct you on is that it is the plural "you" that is used in 48:25, i.e. YOU (plural) did not recognise fellow believers, not only the prophet.

504

General Discussions / Re: Why should we face towards the Kaaba(mecca) while praying ?

« on: October 12, 2012, 03:14:33 AM »

w/salaam saba,

Athar also means physical mark, trace, 40:21, 40:82, 20:84. So what clear 'evidence' do you have that the mark here CANNOT be due to a physical prostration? Thanks Saba

Firstly, I am not disputing it can mean physical mark/trace, as is clear from what I wrote:

"The word "athar" (root: Alif-Tha-Ra) basically means "that which is left behind from something" hence its meanings such as trace/mark/impression/teaching/influence and is not necessarily a physical thing, see 5:46, 18:6, 20:96, 30:50."

And with regards to what "clear evidence" I have. Other than what I already posted, none.

You seem to neglect the other things I mentioned however. So, allow me to ask you:

1) Can "athar" mean a non-physical/literal mark in Quran? Yes/No.
2) Do all people who perform the traditional prayer multiple times per day have a physical mark on their forehead? Yes/No.
3) If you answer "no" to Q2 above, can you estimate a % who do, in your opinion. I personally think <5% but let me know what you think.
4) 48:29 says "fee their wajh" - what is the most common translation of "fee" in Quran? Is it "in" or "on"?
5) Does "wajh" always mean the physical "face" in Quran?
6) Does the word "sima" always mean physical mark / identifying feature?
7) 48:25 clearly states fellow believers were unknown/unrecognisable - how do you reconcile this with believers having a mark upon their forehead, if that is your view?


Thanks.

505

General Discussions / Re: Quran which was written during time of Prophet Muhammad.

« on: October 11, 2012, 09:45:20 PM »

salaam,

See: http://www.islamic-awareness.org/Quran/Text/Mss/

506

Discussions / Re: Jesus Crufixion

« on: October 11, 2012, 01:26:22 AM »

salaam,

I believe Ahmad Deedat wrote a leaflet/book about Jesus' crucifxion in The Bible, called "crucifiction or crucifixion?". You can likely read it online.

From my Quran studies in terms of what is most likely, it seems that it appeared to them that Jesus had died on the cross, but likely became unconcious/fainted. He then probably lived a period after before dying.

Not only does the above fit with The Quran, but also explains The Biblical/Christian interpretation of him being raised alive, and its associated myths.

Links available upon request.

507

General Discussions / Re: Why should we face towards the Kaaba(mecca) while praying ?

« on: October 10, 2012, 09:46:40 PM »

w/salaam saba,

In verse 48:29 it says "The mark of them is on their faces from the traces of prostration (sjd). Given your definition which I note does not include physical prostration, how do these marks appear? Saba

Good question. See TS' post above. However, the latter part of that post is missing, which also covers the question, shown below:


Source

48:24 And He is the One who withheld their hands against you, and your hands against them in midst/interior (of) crowding/MaKKah, after He had made you victorious over them. God is Seer of what you do.
48:25 They are those who concealed/rejected and hindered you from/concerning* al maSJD al haram, and prevented the offering/gift from reaching its permitted/lawful place. And if not for believing men and believing women whom you did not know, that you may trample them so would befall you from them sin without knowledge, that God may admit in His mercy whomever He wills. If they had been apart** surely We would then have punished those who concealed/rejected among them with a painful retribution.
48:26 When those who concealed/rejected had put in their hearts disdain, the disdain of the ignorance, then God sent down His tranquility upon His messenger and upon the believers, and made them adhere to the word of righteousness/God-consciousness, and they were more deserving of it and worthy of it. And God is fully aware of all things.
48:27 Certainly, God has confirmed His messenger's vision*** with truth/reality, surely you (plural) will enter al masjid al haram, if God wills, securing/trusting, unburdening/relieving your chiefs/representatives****, and restraining/relinquishing not fearing. So, He knew what you did not know, and He made besides that a victory near/close.
48:28 He is the One who sent His messenger with the guidance and the system/obligation of truth, so that it would expose all other systems. And God is sufficient as a witness.
*Arabic: AAani is a preposition and can mean: from, of, for, about, concerning.
**implies they are all mixed together. One possible meaning of MKK is "crowding" hence the rendition above (Ref: one, two, three). Could also be a reference to 8:33.
*** Arabic: 'al ruya' (dream/vision), see analysis of 17:1-7 and 17:60
**** see discussion of 2:196 above. Many translators interpolate "hair" and imply the "wa/and" which follows means "or" to make their rendition fit better.

48:25 implies both believing men and women were present and out in public and were unknown to the believers addressed. Note the possible link between this and the utilisation of AMAH in 2:148-150 in bringing you all together and completing of God's favour.
"not fearing" likely implies that it is possible to enter AMAH fearing, and perhaps previously the believers did so. See in conjunction with 2:114.
As a side note, 48:25 clearly implies that it would not be possible to identify believers amongst the people, thus interpretations of 48:29 that imply a physical mark upon believer's faces (from prostrating) is highly unlikely.

508

General Discussions / Re: Why should we face towards the Kaaba(mecca) while praying ?

« on: October 10, 2012, 09:26:30 PM »

w/salaam Joseph,

As I'm sure you are aware, I too have a preference for quality over quantity. And I'm sure you are also aware I have spent much time/effort/money in improving the standard of quality when it comes to Quran study, via StudyQuran.org and other projects etc.

You may have asked your moderators to run a tight ship but in this instance let's be clear, we are talking about the creation of a new dedicated thread to discuss something in detail, on something that is not the original topic of this thread. Hardly worthy of a threat to ban such a member.

As you will know, there is already a plethora of misinformation abound. I seek not to add to it by allowing this forum to become a repository for a quagmire of thoughts in flux. Hence my focus, and I trust you will respect my outlook on this matter.

I hope you are making a general statement only, and not one specific to me. Anyone who has read my thousands of posts on Quran topics, read my articles etc will know that I am very careful in what I write, and it is rare to find the content unevidenced by way of Quran and/or reason. And lastly, I am open to discussion on anything I have written, in fact, I welcome it. As I like to say "I'd rather be corrected in this life than the next".

Regards,
Wakas

509

General Discussions / Re: Why should we face towards the Kaaba(mecca) while praying ?

« on: October 10, 2012, 09:14:02 PM »

w/salaam TS,

The reason for the new thread was simple. This thread is about "Why should we face towards the Kaaba(mecca)  while praying ?" and I was asked a question on marks on one's face from sujud. Now, whilst I'm sure one can link the two, to me, it is off-topic.

I am a member of several forums and moderate some, and to me, it is disrespectful to derail another's thread and discuss something off-topic. It seems you do not mind this in this instance.

As per your forum rules:

(l)     Links to external websites must be relevant to the topic. Where they are deemed to be inappropriate, they will be removed.

510

General Discussions / Re: Why should we face towards the Kaaba(mecca) while praying ?

« on: October 10, 2012, 02:44:16 AM »

salaam all,

My understanding is as follows:

The Quranic evidence weighs the evidence in favour of SuJuD meaning "to submit/honour/pay respect".

"masjid" meaning "time of SJD"

"al masjid al haram" meaning "the inviolable time of SJD" (i.e. the term referring to the time-period/event of the inviolable months).

This understanding provides a logical, coherent and practical answer throughout, and helps answer some of the most difficult questions in Quran exegesis (e.g. 17:1, 2:142-150).


Notes:
For SJD above you can substitute from "submission", "paying respect", "honour", i.e. any of the SuJuD meanings above.
By "inviolable months" I am referring to "al ashhur al hurum" mentioned in Quran.


If you require evidence and clarification for the above, please state so here and I will provide it, and if you wish to discuss such an understanding in detail I can create a new thread.