Messages

76

General Discussions / Re: Re: Wearing trouser/pants below ankle! & Code 19

« on: February 06, 2016, 11:05:21 AM »

Salam Sardar,

It is allowable to marry a Christian lady under Quranic law. It is allowable to apply for a visa. You're conducting ad hom on RK. Our purpose in this debate is to judge his arguments and theories, not his persona.

Good Logic, you have not answered our specific questions or adequately shown why you believe this "interlock" is a miracle for verification of the Quran.

Mia

77

General Discussions / Re: No Sect!

« on: February 05, 2016, 09:42:21 AM »

Very depressing. 

What can we do to teach people to follow the Quran correctly?

Even Quran-centric Muslims divide themselves into sects.

78

Discussions / Re: Religious authority to specific Sunnah practices

« on: February 05, 2016, 09:40:15 AM »

This is an important question.

Salah is prescribed in the Quran. The Sunnah tells us Muhammad's preferred method of doing it. It is possible that the Sunnah method of doing salah is one of the best forms of prayer, and we can follow it if we want to.

However, we don't HAVE to follow it.

The ways in which Muhammad conducted himself (in salah, charity, etc.) are definitely good ways to do things, but they're most likely based on the society in which he lived. Thus, we don't have to follow them. However, if Muhammad's methods are practical in this society and they work well for us, then we can follow them if we like.

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General Discussions / Re: Re: Wearing trouser/pants below ankle! & Code 19

« on: February 05, 2016, 09:37:55 AM »

Oh, sorry--can't modify my previous posts. Perhaps one of the moderators can get rid of those links if they deem it necessary.

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General Discussions / Re: Re: Wearing trouser/pants below ankle! & Code 19

« on: February 05, 2016, 09:36:37 AM »

Yes, the Quran is "locked" by that code--but only after you manipulate it to remove two verses.

I'm sorry, but if someone is removing verses from the Quran, they've got to be making a mistake. Many false prophets have existed. Please don't be misled by Rashad Khalifa.

I am also going to answer the questions you proposed for Brother Hassan.

1) "Why is Bismillah missing from Surah 9?"

How should I know, and why should the fact that "Bismillah" is missing mean this surah is manipulated? Allah advises us against perversely pursuing ambiguities like this one. And yet you continue to do so.

2) "Why do you believe the Quran is the word of God? How/why?"

I have been introduced to it since childhood. I never truly believed in it until my faith was shaken up and I started researching it. First of all, the arguments that it presents make perfect sense. In fact, most of the Quran's arguments are simply reiterating the highly obvious fact that most people tend to miss: God is here, He is infinitely good, and He wants us to listen to Him so we can be good too.

Second of all, there are many facts in the Quran regarding science that have turned out to be true. Although these facts are recognizably vague and can be reinterpreted to fit the times, and although I do not argue in favor of scouring scripture to find "scientific miracles", these facts have certainly strengthened my faith.

Third of all, as far as I can tell, everything in the Quran has turned out to be true and WILL turn out to be true. Even this whole 19-code fluff was predicted in Surah 74.

Fourth, the Quranic challenge still stands: Everyone who attempts to bring "a surah like it" always fails miserably and attracts a lot of mockery. Just look up "The True Furqan" book reviews on Amazon. They say it all.

And fifth: It just makes sense. I can see connections from the verses to things in my everyday life. I am sure you will agree that this book could not have been written by a human being. In addition to this, the Quran presents the most logically unbiased view of human nature, God's nature, and morality. There is no substitutional atonement or "original sin" or instances of God having children who die on the cross for no reason at all.

I'm sorry, but I don't need mathematical "codes" to see that the Quran is the obvious and most importantly, unadulterated word of God.

And please think about what you are saying. According to false prophet RK, the Quran, which Allah promised to guard, has been corrupted for 1400 years! This is a blatant lie.

Also, please note that I am removing the Answering Islam and WikiIslam links from above. These websites spread anti-Islamic sentiments and I think that the specific articles I cited have already served their purpose in this debate.

Mia

81

Women / Re: Women Modest Dress Example

« on: February 05, 2016, 09:21:36 AM »

Salam ,

I think you have to figure it out based on where you live. India is not like Saudi Arabia. That dress should be perfectly modest for India in my opinion, however you wouldn't want to wear it to the mosque.

Sardar Miyan: Did you get my reply? Hadiths hold no religious authority.

Mia

82

Women / Re: Women Modest Dress Example

« on: February 04, 2016, 11:46:03 AM »

Salam Hassan, thank you for your reply

Sardar, I'm confused. I thought we didn't do hadiths around here. In fact you complained about them in your other posts.

83

Women / Re: Women Modest Dress Example

« on: February 04, 2016, 07:33:27 AM »

Also, I have to say that it is very sad how "modest" dressing is only stressed for women. It's like men can walk around and look at women and do whatever perverted things they want, and it's always the women's fault--because they were dressed "inappropriately". Sigh.

To the contrary, a certain manner of dressing and cooperation is prescribed for both genders in 24:30-31. Men are equally responsible for dealing with themselves. In addition to this, they should be able to control themselves. Looking at a woman's hair should not make them do bad things. If it does, then they should see a doctor. It's that simple.

"Tell the believing men to lower their gaze and be modest. That is purer for them. Lo! Allah is aware of what they do."

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Women / Re: Women Modest Dress Example

« on: February 04, 2016, 07:24:18 AM »

Salam everyone,

Sstikstoff: Please look at the articles I cited above for head-coverings. They're not compulsory, but they're the standard in many societies.

Sardar: You're saying the girl in the picture looks like she's not dressed in a "Muslim" way. What is a "Muslim" way, I must ask? Are we supposed to dress in shalwars and black shrouds that look like Darth Vader costumes (sorry, I had to say that )? These are cultural types of clothing, not religious types. Christian women who live in supposedly sharia-compliant places like Saudi Arabia also wear the black dresses. These kinds of clothing are cultural and not religious.

I see no problem with her hair being loose. I mean, it's not covered in fake flowers or anything.

As for her arms, I see no issue with that either. Judging by the place I live in, that dress is quite modest. It might be different where you live. Here, adult women walk the streets in Daisy Dukes at the height of winter. So that dress is basically what people would wear to church service. Except for the slit at the bottom--I could do without that.

Adam: There's nothing wrong with wearing western clothing, as long as it doesn't show anything unnecessary. God does not want hardship for us. He wants us to dress modestly for the places we live in. You're right, "sharia compliant airline services" are hilariously ridiculous. Anyway, please don't feel constrained by anything your government is doing. You can make good choices without their interference.

Mia

85

General Discussions / Re: Re: Wearing trouser/pants below ankle! & Code 19

« on: February 04, 2016, 07:15:45 AM »

Salam Good Logic,

Please see the below article:

http://www.quranicpath.com/finerpoints/19.html

Read it from top to bottom, please. It says EVERYTHING I need to say about this alleged miracle.

Especially read the part about pursuing Quranic ambiguities and how this act leads to the rejection of perfectly good verses. And read the interpretations of verses 74:31-31.

This next article is written by a highly annoying website called Answering Islam, but I think it refutes the theory quite well. (Again, if this is against forum policy, can you tell me?, because I don't want to get in trouble.)

http://answering-islam.org/authors/katz/rebuttals/taslaman/allahs_timing.html

Again, I certainly DO NOT ENDORSE Answering Islam, but when they write semi-decent articles that refute actual silliness, I think they're worth sharing.

I hope you'll keep an open mind about this. The Quranicpath article given above is really the best one I've found on this topic, because it goes into more technicalities than Joseph's. Please read it.

Mia

86

Women / Re: Women Modest Dress Example

« on: February 03, 2016, 11:38:24 AM »

Oops, didn't realize that the dress had a slit in the bottom. Take that away and it would be fine, I think, based on where I live.

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Women / Re: Women Modest Dress Example

« on: February 03, 2016, 06:43:32 AM »

Salam,

#1: Alright depending on the circumstances. Probably better for high-school kids' concerts.

#2: Fine

#3: Fine

This works too:



Covering hair is not compulsory:

https://quranistvoices.wordpress.com/2011/05/27/the-concept-of-hijab-and-veiling-in-the-quran-and-quranists/

https://sfqomhz.wordpress.com/2013/07/10/hijab-compulsion-or-choice/

...although if you live in a Muslim-majority country, you're going to get arrested if you don't cover. 

Mia

88

General Discussions / Re: Re: Wearing trouser/pants below ankle! & Code 19

« on: February 03, 2016, 06:36:50 AM »

Also, Hassan, you said you were going to comment on #2 after gathering your thoughts

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General Discussions / Re: Re: Wearing trouser/pants below ankle! & Code 19

« on: February 03, 2016, 06:35:32 AM »

Salam,

Sorry, wrong link. Here's the actual debunking one:

https://wikiislam.net/wiki/The_Miracle_of_19

By the way, I'm really sorry if this is against forum rules! WikiIslam seems anti-Islamic, but the rest of the "debunking" sites were either too long or required a download. I absolutely do not agree with the WikiIslamic sentiments, but this specific article does debunk the 19 code pretty well.

Also, you didn't answer my question. Where did you get the idea that you can simply take away Quranic verses because of this code?

(In case you don't want to open the article I mentioned above, just look at the conclusion for a sec:)

This "miracle" of 19 is not a miracle. The actual chance of finding this 'miracle' is 1 in 19 which is not an impressive probability at all.
Equal number of miracles, sometimes more are found in anti-Islamic texts.
Where the Qur'an says, "over it are Nineteen," it was simply talking about the number of angels in Hell. This is also confirmed by Muslim websites.[3] Even Rashad Khalifa, the inventor of 19 'miracles' believes that 19 is the number of Angels in heaven (for him, he sees it as a 'miracle' that everything is 19)
Rashad Khalifa changed or 'corrupted' the Qur'an to highlight the 'miracles' of 19.

This is really all you need to see.

Mariyah

90

General Discussions / Re: Do animals know right from wrong?

« on: February 03, 2016, 06:28:46 AM »

Salam, thank you for the article

It confirmed what I asserted earlier. Animals might not have the same kind of souls as humans, but they do have some kind.

I've seen that Battle of Kruger thing on Nat Geo Wild. It's disturbing...don't know if anyone else agrees...but the other two are good