6 day creation of the world?

[Lobotomize94]

Let me be the first to say that I am not a supporter that the Quran has "scientific miracles" in it. I do not believe that is what the Quran was meant for.

But this one thing showed up and I'm wondering if it is a coincidence.

The Quran states that the Universe (heavens AND earth) was created in 6 periods. Quran 7:54

The Quran then states that Earth was created in 2 periods. Quran 41:9.

Now both the Quran and modern physics testify that time is relative. So 6 periods could equal any amount of time.

Moving forward. By the 2 verses given above, it appears that the Quran states that earth is 2/6th (or 1/3) the age of the universe.

Now if we apply this to modern measurements of the age of the universe (which COULD change):

The universe is 13.7 billion years old. The Earth is 4.54 billion years old.

By a simply division, 4.54/13.7 you get a number that is roughly 1/3rd. That means the Earth is 1/3rd the age of the universe by modern measurements.

Is there something to this?

Now one could argue that in a few billion years that ratio would not be 1/3rd. And you would rightly argue that. It appears that the Quran further tells us that the heavens and the Earth and everything in them has been created in 6 days.

[Quran 50:38] And indeed we created the heavens and the earth and all between them in six periods

What is between the heavens and the Earth? Humans. That means the age of the universe when Allah created all the heavens and the Earth and the humans is 6 days. When the Quran says that Allah created the Universe and the Earth and Everything in between them (including humans) in six days this means that the Quran is referring to the period of existence. That means that in the distant future, the Quran would say that Allah created the universe and the earth and all that is between them (what will become between them) in 7, or 8, or 9 periods and so on. 

[Lobotomize94]

I wanted to break down Quran 41:9-11.

(Quran 41:9) Say, "Do you indeed disbelieve in He who created the earth in two days and attribute to Him equals? That is the Lord of the worlds."

This verse seems to directly state the Earth was created in two days.

(Quran 41:10) And He placed on the earth firmly set mountains over its surface, and He blessed it and determined therein its [creatures'] sustenance in four days without distinction - for [the information] of those who ask.

This verse does not use the conjunction "then", it uses "and" so it is not saying that after he created the earth he put mountains on it etc.. Rather he is saying that he created the Earth in two days and he placed mountains and he blessed it and..etc. There is no "then". He is just describing his creation.

Furthermore, Allah determined the creatures sustenance in four days. This does not mean that he took 2 days to create the Earth and then another 4 in sustaining the Earth. This is because of the lack of usage of "then" or "thumma".

Rather it means that Allah determined/measured/decreed the sustenance of creatures in 4 days.

"(Quran 41:11) Then He directed Himself to the heaven while it was smoke and said to it and to the earth, "Come [into being], willingly or by compulsion." They said, "We have come willingly."

After Allah has measured/determined/decreed the creatures sustenance, he formed the Earth with a piece of the heaven. Notice the usage of "thumma" or then. This definitely implies a time period.

(Quran 41:12)  And He completed them as seven heavens within two days and inspired in each heaven its command. And We adorned the nearest heaven with lamps and as protection. That is the determination of the Exalted in Might, the Knowing.

There is a package of usage of "thumma", rather there is "fa" which does not necessarily denote time. So this verse is stating what else Allah has done. Allah has completed the several heavens within 2 days and put each heaven its command.

Here is a graphic describing what I mean:

[Joseph Islam]

Dear Labotomize94,

As-salam alaykum

I have an illustration of a similar matter that you discuss in your posts above. Please let me know if you note any material divergence of views.

CREATION OF THE UNIVERSE IN SIX PERIODS
http://quransmessage.com/charts%20and%20illustrations/six%20periods/six%20periods%20FM2.htm

Also, with regards your sentiment "Let me be the first to say that I am not a supporter that the Quran has "scientific miracles" in it. I do not believe that is what the Quran was meant for. ", please see the following article with which you may find general agreement.

SCIENTIFIC MIRACLES IN THE QURAN
http://quransmessage.com/articles/science%20miracles%20FM3.htm

Regards,
Joseph

[Lobotomize94]

As-salam alaykum

I have an illustration of a similar matter that you discuss in your posts above. Please let me know if you note any material divergence of views.

Dear, Joseph Islam

As-salam alaykum,

Thanks for providing your illustration. As you know, there is a slight divergence of views and that is absolutely okay.

Quran 41:11 Then He directed Himself to the heaven (sam'aa) while it was smoke and said to it and to the earth, "Come [into being], willingly or by compulsion." They said, "We have come willingly."

Quran 41:11 does not use a plural for heavens (samawat), rather it uses Sam'aa which is singular. To me, this appears to mean that a part of the heavens and the Earth came into being together rather than the entirety of the heavens and the Earth came together. Also this interpretation is scientifically supported. The earth was created through accretion (or the coming together) or space gas, dust and dubree (Quran uses the word "smoke") under the force of gravity.

This interpretation also avoids the contradiction where the Quran states that he created the heavens and the earth by spreading them rather than putting them together.

“Have those who disbelieved not considered that the heavens and the earth were a joined entity, then We separated them, and made from water every living thing?  Then will they not believe?” (Quran 21:30)

So it appears that the universe (heavens and earth) was one joined entity, and Allah separated it (big bang) and then made a piece of the heaven and the Earth come together.

So given this I believe the best interpretation is that a piece of the heaven and the Earth came together AFTER Allah determined the length of time he decreed for the earth to form. Allah's decree was that the Earth would form after 4 days. I have broken down the verses in my second post on this thread (for reference).

Please let me know what you think. I'm definately interested in this. It appears that Quran 41:9-12 is worded in a weird way in my perception. In fact many articles (anti Islamic, of course) state that these verses mean that the universe was created in 8 days and not six--which is obviously wrong on close inspection. The parts of this verse were not mentioned in sequential order!!! It is not like Allah created the Earth in two days and THEN put mountains in 4 days and THEN created the several universes/heavens... This can be verified linguistically through the usages of 'and' (wa), 'then' (thumma), and 'fa' (so/and).

[Lobotomize94]

Brother Joseph, this is the most perfect explanation on the scientific miracles:

"The Quran does indeed present fascinating facts and reveals a heightened understanding and appreciation of creation and its environment. However, the primary focus for the presentation of these facts was to convince the desert Arabs. No doubt as science would have advanced, further insights into the Quranic statements would have become apparent.".

Absolutely perfect. My agreement 100%. Given this, further insight like the relative age of the earth may become apparent.

I need to get more familiar with your articles, currently, I'm reading the hadith related ones and I must say that I am convinced.

[ahmad]

As salam alaykum ,

I just had a question related to this thread.

Some people refer to the following verse to state that the references to scientific phenomena in the Quran, are meant to be miracles that will be shown to humanity (arguably in the future) to proof the divinity of the Quran.

[41:53] Saheeh International
We will show them Our signs in the horizons and within themselves until it becomes clear to them that it is the truth. But is it not sufficient concerning your Lord that He is, over all things, a Witness?


Is there a different interpretation ?

Thank you