Challenging Joseph Islam's view

[Muhammad Azhar]

Dear Joseph,

Assalamu alaikum wa rahmatullah.

In the link below you discuss about Adam being nude when he was created and you say, "Arguably much like the animal kingdom or human children, Adam would have no concept of 'shame' from nudity as we understand today. This was the state they were in (20:118) and it was from this state they were also removed after they had sinned (7:22). Many animals remain in a 'nude' state and conduct their business without this seemingly being an issue."

Link: http://quransmessage.com/forum/index.php?topic=1505.75

However, I find that there is a problem with this understanding because according to 7:27 Adam had clothes on his body:

O Children of Adam! Do not let Satan seduce you, as he drove your parents out of the Garden, stripping them of their garments, to show them their nakedness. He sees you, him and his clan, from where you cannot see them. We have made the devils friends of those who do not believe. (7:27)

I am looking forward to have your reply on this.

[Joseph Islam]

Dear Muhammad Azhar,

Wa alaikum assalam

Welcome to the forum!

It appears clear from verse 7:22 that both Adam and his wife started to hide themselves with the leaves of the Garden after their shame became apparent / manifest. The Arabic description is more of fastening over themselves (yakhsifani alahima) to clearly indicate the concealment of body areas. This intimates that before that point, their shame (as we understand it) was exposed. Otherwise there would arguably be no need for this action.

As far as verse 7:27 is concerned, it remains noteworthy that the Arabic noun 'libas' has actually been used numerous times in the Quran to denote the meaning of cloaking, disguising, enveloping and not necessarily tangible clothing at all times. The metaphorical sense of the word garb as to cover is also assumed.

For example,

002:187 - they are 'garbs' (libas) for you and you are 'garbs' (libas) for them,
007:026 - But the 'garb' (libas) of God-fearing / righteousness - that is better / best
[In this verse libas is used to denote something tangible and otherwise]
016:112 - So God let it taste the 'garb' (libas) of hunger
025:047 - It is He who appointed the night for you to be a 'garb' (libas) (libas) and sleep for a rest
078:010 - and We appointed night for a 'garb' (libas)

Hence in verse 7:27, it can be quite cogently argued that the garb referred to here was their garb of shame which stripped, not physical clothes which would put the verse in tension with other verses such as 7:22.

I hope that helps, God willing

I will not be able to enter debates / protracted discussions as per my link below. Therefore, I do hope that my humble response provides some elucidation to my view.
http://quransmessage.com/forum/index.php?topic=1171.0

Regards,
Joseph

[Muhammad Azhar]

Dear Joseph,

May peace be unto you.

After considering your answer, I did research on it, and I am satisfied that your answer makes a lot of sense, so jazak Allahu khair for that.

I have another issue that I am dealing with which is regarding riba. I have opened a new thread for it. Please take a look at it and help us all who are dealing with such issues concerning riba.


Salam