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Offline Student

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Sacred Months?
« on: March 27, 2016, 09:18:26 AM »
Salamun Alaykum,
Brother Joseph,

I hope you and your family are keeping well by the grace of Allah swt. I know you're engaged in lots of academic stuff bringing out the best for all of us. May I divert your attention for a bit on this site (please see below) where the brother's assertion for Islamic sacred months are different than what you've presented. Since his set include Ramadan, and no Qital is allowed in Ramadan I've hard time dismissing his assertion. Your help is much appreciated in identifying the flaws, if any in his 4 months reckoning.

http://www.quranaloneislam.net/the-4-sacred-months-of-hajj

Thank you,
Student.
Thanks,
~ Student

Offline Student

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Re: Sacred Months?
« Reply #1 on: June 23, 2016, 09:52:51 AM »
Salamun Alaykum,
Brother Joseph,

Ramadan Mubarak to you and your family. Hope you're enjoying the blessed days of Ramadan. I'm relaying the response I got from the author of the article after I shared your twin articles with him just as I've shared his with you in the above originating post:

Quote
Salaam dear XXX,

I've been unable to answer several emails on my websites, but I took the time to answer yours.

The article you pointed at does not gather all the verses necessary to solve the puzzle and correctly identify the four sacred months of hajj, and this is why it doesn’t.

I think we both agree that “yawmul hajji al akbar” is the first day of the four months of hajj and that sura 9 was revealed as a result on the first day of the four sacred months, when God issued a warning to the disbelievers:

(9:2) Therefore, roam through the land [freely] for four months, and know that you cannot escape from GOD, and that GOD humiliates the disbelievers.

9:2 sets the final countdown for the disbelievers on day one of the four sacred lunar months (118 lunar days left to go).

(9:3) And [this is] a proclamation from God and his messenger to the people, on the day of the greatest pilgrimage, that God is no longer bound with the idol worshipers, and [neither is] his messenger. Therefore, if you repent, it will be better for you; but if you turn away, then know that you cannot escape from God; and warn those who disbelieve of a painful retribution. 

(9:5) So once the [four consecutive] sacred months are over, then kill the idol worshipers wherever you may encounter them, seize them, besiege them, and wait for them everywhere you can ambush them. But if they repent, observe the ritual prayer and pay the zakât, then do not stand in their way; Indeed, God is Oft Forgiving, Most Merciful.

The key verse is 9:28:

يايها الذين ءامنوا انما المشركون نجس فلا يقربوا المسجد الحرام بعد عامهم هذا وان خفتم عيلة فسوف يغنيكم الله من فضله ان شاء ان الله عليم حكيم

(9:28) O you who believe, the idol worshipers are impure, so do not let them approach the sacred Mosque after their [final] lunar year herein witnessed; and if you fear poverty, then God will enrich you with His bounty, if He so desires. Indeed, God is Omniscient, Most Wise. 

Since God is telling that the idol worshipers cannot go to the sacred mosque after (literal translation) “This lunar year of theirs” (بعد عامهم هذا : demonstrative pronoun hadha), it means that the four sacred months are all part of the same lunar year as when the sura was revealed, that is to say that they are all part of the same lunar year (again, 9:28, like the entire sura 9, was revealed on day one of the four sacred months of hajj). By definition, since they are continuous and that the last month of the year is Dhul Hijjah (unquestionably a sacred month of hajj), they are the last four of the lunar year (Ramadan to Dhul Hijjah = 9 to 12). There is simply no other possibility to reconcile and make sense of all relevant Quranic verses. 

In addition, and as I mentioned in the article:

- The month of Ramadan is mentioned amongst verses that deal with the hajj, which concurs with what I said:

(2:158) Indeed, [the knolls of] Al Safa and Al Marwah are among of the rites inspired by God. Therefore, whoever performs the Hajj to the [Sacred] House, or performs ‘Umrah, there is no blame upon him to go around the two of them. And whoever volunteers for more, then God is indeed Appreciative, Omniscient. (2:184) A definite number of days [are designated for fasting]: Therefore, whoever among you is sick or on a journey will make up for the missing days at a later date; those who experience great difficulty [fasting] can substitute a ransom feeding the poor;  whoever volunteers more, it is better for him; [but] fasting is better for you, if only you knew.(2:185) The month of Ramadan is the one during which the Quran was revealed as a guidance for mankind,  [providing] proofs corroborating that guidance, as well as the ability to distinguish [between right and wrong]. Therefore, whoever among you witnesses this month shall fast therein; whoever is sick or on a journey will make up for the missing days at a later date. God wants to facilitate things for you and does not intend any hardship upon you, so you may fulfill the prescribed period and magnify God for having guided you, and for you to be appreciative.

(2:189) They ask you about the new moons: Say: “They are starting points to determine time for mankind, including the pilgrimage (Hajj). It is not righteousness for you to enter homes from their rear; on the contrary, righteous is the one who fears God and enters homes from their [front] door. Fear God, that you may succeed.

(2:194) The Sacred Month belongs with the sacred month: Transgression shall be met by an equivalent retaliation. Therefore, whoever commits a violation against you, [you are then allowed to] commit a violation against him in a similar manner as he transgressed against you. Fear God, and know that God is with the [God] fearing. 

(2:196) You shall complete the Hajj and the Umrah for the sake of God, but if you are prevented [from performing them], then sacrifice an animal that you can easily afford; and do not shave your heads until the sacrificial animal has reached its destination. But whoever lacks the means shall fast three days during the Hajj, and seven when you return, which makes it ten entire [days]. This applies for someone whose family is not in the precincts of the Sacred Mosque. Fear God, and know that God is severe in retribution. (2:197) Hajj shall be observed during the well known months. Therefore, anyone who is going on the Hajj during that time shall abstain from any intimate relationship, misconduct and quarrelling during the Hajj. And God knows full well any good that you do. And stock up on supplies, but, in reality, the most important thing that you need is righteousness. And fear Me, O you who possess intelligence!

- Finally, in 28:27 the word “pilgrimages” is synonym with “lunar years”:

(28:27) He (Reuel) said: “I wish to marry you (Moses) to one of my two daughters, in return of which you will work for me for eight pilgrimages; it will then be up to you if you complete ten; I do not wish to make it difficult for you. You will find me, God willing, righteous”.

The reason is obvious: Like 9:28, it confirms that the four month pilgrimage always takes place during the same “lunar year”, and certainly not over two lunar years like Joseph Islam and many others have guessed.

Consequently, Ramadan 1st is the “day of the greatest pilgrimage” and not the first day of Dhul Hijjah.

God bless you.

Pierre

When you get a chance can you please take some time and comment on my request to you (in my above post) and question for you and for Pierre I wrote in response to his above email:

Quote
Walekumus Salaam
Wa Rahmatullahi Wa Barakatuhu,
Brother Pierre,

Thank you so much for taking time and giving preference to my inquiry, I indeed really appreciate it. Jazak Allah Khair. My mind and more than that my heart is inclined and leaning towards your analysis as both you and Joseph Islam made one pivotal point as non-Quranic or extra-Quranic text:

Pierre: (again, 9:28, like the entire sura 9, was revealed on day one of the four sacred months of hajj).

Joseph Islam: One simply cannot overlook the connection with the 3rd month of the calendar being described as Rabi which is also the last of the fourth sacred months starting from Dhul-Hijjah (12, 1, 2 and 3 in succession).

May I ask you this question on your assertion what's your source of information for assuming Sura 9 being revealed as whole? This is tall claim which needs to be strongly backed up with undeniable proof. Hope you understand my dilemma.

I've raised my question and shared your article with Joseph Islam earlier but haven't heard back from him. Inshallah between both of you may Allah swt guide me to the truth and may I fulfill this huge obligation with certainty and peace of mind.

Thank you once again, and Jazak Allah Khair for your time and effort.

Take care,
Thanks,
~ Student

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Re: Sacred Months?
« Reply #2 on: July 08, 2016, 02:48:29 AM »
Salaam,
Respected brother Joseph,

Hope you had a blessed month of Ramadan. I apologize if I violated terms and conditions of the forum by bringing outside discussion and making the comparison. I hope you'll forgive in that case and I would be greatly indebted to you if present your argument which invalidates 9-12 as holy months. I have not fulfilled my Hajj obligation yet and I intend to do at my earliest convenience outside official Dhul Hajja for many reasons. Hopefully another deed of mine stands corrected per Quran with many thanks to you!

Hoping to hear from you soon, Inshallah  :D

Thanks and Jazak Allahu Khairan
~Student
Thanks,
~ Student

Offline Joseph Islam

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Re: Sacred Months?
« Reply #3 on: September 10, 2016, 01:52:48 AM »
Dear Student, 

As-salamu alaykum

At one point it appears that the author is arguing that 'yawmul hajji al akbar' is the first day of the four months of hajj (I assume therefore, continuous from thereon) and then in another part asserts that the 'four month pilgrimage always takes place during the same “lunar year”, and certainly not over two lunar years like Joseph Islam and many others have guessed.'

Firstly with respect, I have not once stipulated when the start of the Islamic / Quranic calendar should be or when the end should be from a Quranic perspective. I have only shared what the traditionalist understanding is of the start of the calendar and any naming conventions used by the Arabs to name their months which appear to be of relevance.

I've only posited when the sacred months should be and that appears to agree with the first part of the author's assertion (i.e. consecutively from the first day of the four months of Hajj).

Please note that whilst it is true that the Quran speaks about the Quran being revealed in a certain month (Ramadan); it speaks about Hajj; it speaks about the 12 lunar months  being the correct religion (deen), at no point does the Quran stipulate the start and end of the lunar year. It could well be that the 4th month after Hajj was the end of a lunar calendar as understood by Arabs at the time of the Quran's revelation?

Therefore in summary, my article had no intention to stipulate whether the 4 months were the last 4 months of the lunar calendar or the first four. It merely identified that there were 4 months which were sacred months in which Hajj could be arguably completed and that it was most cogent in my opinion, to assume that the 'sacred months' should run in succession starting from Dhū al-Ḥijja. (Start of Hajj).
 
As you wish to perform Hajj soon, my humble advice from a practical and theologically safest position would be to complete Hajj as is being performed at present. Firstly, whatever interpretation one favours, this is a common month from both non-traditional views you have sought (including mine) and of course, is 'practically' supported by the traditionalists where all facilities are laid out to support the pilgrimage.

My view would be why should one impose hardship on themselves when God doesn't want to impose hardship on His worshippers? The point is about completion and the availability of the resources to complete the action.

In other words, there may be aspects of the Hajj which may not be easy to complete such as an expectation for visiting Arafat for Hajj purposes [1]

002:198-200 (part)
"It is no sin for you that you seek the bounty of your Lord. And when you depart from Arafat, then remember God near the sacred monument (Arabic: Mash'ari-lharami). Remember Him as He has guided you, although before you were surely of those who went astray. Then depart from wherever the people depart and ask forgiveness of God. Indeed, God is Forgiving, Merciful. Then when you have completed your acts of worship, then remember God as you remember your forefathers or with greater remembrance...."
 
The Quran acknowledges a practice involving the movement of multitudes from Arafat to specific locations. The historical relevance has not been deemed appropriate by the Quran to elaborate bar the purpose which is to remember God. Whatever traditions have reached us, there seems to be sanction for it in the Quran by virtue of the above verses.

I hope this helps, God willing
Joseph


REFERENCES:

[1] THE HAJJ AND UMRAH ACCORDING TO THE QURAN
http://quransmessage.com/articles/hajj%20FM3.htm
[2] THE 'LOST' MONTHS OF HAJJ
http://quransmessage.com/articles/the%20lost%20months%20of%20hajj%20FM3.htm


'During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act' 
George Orwell

Offline Student

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Re: Sacred Months?
« Reply #4 on: September 11, 2016, 01:26:09 PM »
Walekumus salaam,
Dear Joseph Sir,

Thank you very much indeed for addressing my query.  Yes, I agree performing Hajj in the month of Zul Hajja seems to be the best and contention-free practically. However, I wanted to depart from traditional ways especially when we have clear text and support from the Quran and why not take advantage of avoiding crowd of millions to stay focus on and engaged in Zikrullah during entire Pilgrimage. 

From your amazing Quran analysis I get a feeling you're not inclined to explore the mathematical aspect of Quran and I think hints to such puzzles must have been Divinely coded in one or other way for Ulul Albab to discover such as this:


It is definitely fascinating aspect of the Quran and may very well prove beneficial and hold key to issues related to or dealing with number problem in my humble view.

Jazak Allah Khair.
Thanks,
~ Student