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Offline Hamzeh

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Salamu Alykum brothers and sisters

I'm sure many of us heard about the phrase in the verse below that is mainly quoted(out of context) by those who advocate the hadith corpus as a source of authority.

59:7 That which Allah giveth as spoil unto His messenger from the people of the townships, it is for Allah and His messenger and for the near of kin and the orphans and the needy and the wayfarer, that it become not a commodity between the rich among you. And whatsoever the messenger giveth you, take it(wama atakumuarrasoolu fakhuthoohu) . And whatsoever he forbiddeth, abstain (from it). And keep your duty to Allah. Lo! Allah is stern in reprisal.


The phrase in question is "wama atakumuarrasoolu fakhuthoohu wama nahakumAAanhu fantahoo"

What I would like to point out and what I found to be very enlightening by Allah(swt) is that IF the translations of the verse below are correct and IF I am understanding them correctly(please let me know if I am mistaken in anyways), that people who listen to falsehood by way of narrations or hadith by people who came after their respective scriptures is not something newly invented, and Allah(swt) has warned us about these kinds of people Subhan Allah.

People of the past also used to say to their people that 5:41 "If you are given this, take it; but if you are not given it, then beware." by way of changing words from their context.
"in ooteetum hatha fakhuthoohu wa-in lamtu/tawhu fahtharoo"

From what I'm understanding from verse 5:41 is that their was some people from the Jews that used to listen to falsehood through the sayings of the people of the past but of their later generations(which seems to me later generations who came after their scripture "Liqawmin Akhareena") but who has not come to prophet Muhammad. They changed the words from their contexts and followed what was passed down to them from their people who were after their revelations " If you are given this, take it.."

Although from all the translations I seen so far, I do not find that anyone has translated the words "Liqawmin Akhareena" in the english translation. I could be wrong, please correct me if I am not able to comprehend it.

5:41 O Messenger, let them not grieve you who hasten into disbelief of those who say, "We believe" with their mouths, but their hearts believe not, and from among the Jews. [They are] avid listeners to falsehood, listening to another people who have not come to you. They distort words beyond their [proper] usages, saying "If you are given this, take it; but if you are not given it, then beware." But he for whom Allah intends fitnah - never will you possess [power to do] for him a thing against Allah . Those are the ones for whom Allah does not intend to purify their hearts. For them in this world is disgrace, and for them in the Hereafter is a great punishment.

The Lord does tell us that He explains and guides us through examples or by way of those people's practices(good or bad) who were before the revelation sent to prophet Muhammad.

Note again their seems to be differences in translations, if someone can correct me again as I may possibly be saying something that is not warranted.

Sahih International
4:26 Allah wants to make clear to you [the lawful from the unlawful] and guide you to the [good] practices of those before you and to accept your repentance. And Allah is Knowing and Wise.

Pickthall
4:26 Allah would explain to you and guide you by the examples of those who were before you, and would turn to you in mercy. Allah is Knower, Wise.

Sahih International seems to find that the term "sunana" means good practices. Any opinions on this translation?

Anyways I thought maybe I'd share this and someone maybe able to explain it better than me what these verses mean and make it more clear or correct me if I am not understanding them correctly.

Salam  :)

Offline wanderer

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I'm really confused as to what your question is, can you please clarify it so I can try to help?
Regards
wanderer
Rather, We dash the truth upon falsehood, and it destroys it, and thereupon it departs. And for you is destruction from that which you describe. (21:18)

Offline Duster

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Shalom / peace Hamzeh - like brother Wanderer ....I'm totally confused with your question too ... :-\ :-\

Offline Hamzeh

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Salam

Haha I'm really sorry guys. I had a feeling I wasn't being clear enough.  :-[

I was just trying to make a point that only in the event the translations I used are correct that there seems to be a correlation between how people today use the phrase in 59:7 "take what the prophet gives you" to advocate passed down narrations from the people closest in time to the Quranic revelation and how this technique has been used before by the some of the Jews according to verse 5:41.

I found it interesting but before I confirm this interest I was checking to make sure to see if anyone else see's this correlation through this specific verse or am I not understanding it correctly?

Hope this was clearer in some way Insha'Allah

Salam

Offline wanderer

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I don't think there's a connection, but, yes, during the Prophet's time there were certain Jews/Christians, who had concealed/deliberately misread passages of Scripture to suit their own desires. Not so unlike certain Muslim scholars today...
Regards
wanderer
Rather, We dash the truth upon falsehood, and it destroys it, and thereupon it departs. And for you is destruction from that which you describe. (21:18)

Offline Nura

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Salam everyone

Interesting discussion I must say. But I do not see any connection between the two ayats. Ayat 59:7 has the context of dividing spoils of war among believers. And believers are being asked to have faith in the prophet that the prophet has divided the spoils of war fairly and has given each person what they deserved. Believers are being asked not to create a ruckus and just accept the portion they got.

On the other hand, 5:41 has the context of a particular group of people of the book, who used to come to the prophet not with a pure heart to listen to the Quran and discern. But these people used to come to verify whether Muhammad is a true prophet or not. These people used to tell Muhammad that they believe him with their mouths but their hearts were not convinced. They used to listen to their own scholars or learned men, these learned men used to not come to the prophet themselves but used to tell these other people, who were their followers, that if Muhammad says this or that then he is a prophet. But if he does not say this or that, then he is not a prophet. So, here in these verses, God is letting the prophet know about the hypocrisy of that particular group of people of the book, whose secret wish was to test the prophet, not to belive in him or the Quran.

This is what I understand from these ayats but I am looking forward to learning from u guys if I am wrong about them and maybe a more accurate interpretation/ explanation can be provided by the learned brothers and sisters on this forum.

God bless us all  :)
Not all those who wander are lost - J.R.R. Tolkien

Offline Hamzeh

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Asalamu Alykum

Thank you very much for all your inputs, really appreciated and cleared up some thought Alhamdulila.  :)

Peace