Messages

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General Discussions / Re: ISIS soldier dying and smiling ?

« on: June 03, 2016, 10:13:57 PM »

Simple as that. I  do not know why you need to ask this as if it is a phenomenon when it is not.

Thanks for the answer, in fact  I didn't know that have a scientific explanation, and this was the reason to asking this here.

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General Discussions / Re: ISIS soldier dying and smiling ?

« on: June 03, 2016, 07:45:36 AM »

Salaam  ZKAB90

Please can you stick to topics to do with the Quran here and kindly refrain from posting such videos.

Any future infringements may lead to you being removed from this forum.

Thanks

Aleikum salam.

I do not know in which category posting, so I chose the most general. Feel free to change the section of the post.

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General Discussions / Re: ISIS soldier dying and smiling ?

« on: June 02, 2016, 11:39:15 PM »

I found these pages that (maybe) give the answer:

https://themuslimissue.wordpress.com/2013/11/14/al-qaedas-recruitment-campaign-images-of-smiling-dead-terrorists/

http://ask.metafilter.com/247553/Smiling-or-expressions-of-delight-right-before-death

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Near-death_experience

https://www.washingtonpost.com/national/health-science/surge-of-brain-activity-may-explain-near-death-experience-study-says/2013/08/12/47026016-0105-11e3-9a3e-916de805f65d_story.html

What do you think about ?

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General Discussions / Re: ISIS soldier dying and smiling ?

« on: June 02, 2016, 10:38:20 PM »

Salam ZKAB90

No, I personally have not heard of such things.

To put it bluntly, it has nothing to do with faith towards God.

Why confuse and complicate matters of faith by talking about things that have not real value for ones self submission towards Allah?

If they did smile at death, how does that affect you? Will you feel better about yourself? would you feel Islam has triumphed against its enemies?

Is it just to proof that islam is way better than any other forms of faith?

If a non muslim dies with a smile? are you going to be more confused? what about the religious scholars? Ahmad Deedat did not die with a smile on his face. In fact he died a tormenting death after years and years of his so called dakwah to the masses. You can have a look at the Youtube video.

so what is it actually you are trying to figure out? because what you are asking is just plain cheap propaganda to spur the muslim community against non muslims. And it is getting worse.

Every bad thing that happens in the middle east, the muslims blame the west or the jews. They never look at themselves to find out what went wrong.

To top it off, The Saudi Royal family invests' heavily in the Israel cause. Are you aware of that? are you aware that the muslim leaders are not helping out the muslim community?

How much money is collected through zakat? how many muslims are running for their lives? how many are refugees? what are the holders of mecca's key doing to make things better?

And you want to concerntrate your understanding of islam based on the smiling dead?

Come on!

Aleikum salam Adam.

You have get wrong what I means. I'm anti-ISIS. In fact I do not consider them Muslims, they follow Sunnism or maybe a distorted Sunnism.

I'm not talking about religious scholars, I'm talking about soldiers killed that, at they very last moment, show a smile in their face. It can be a physical phenomenon, with a scientific explanation, I do not know.

This is a video (2 min) about Tchetchen radical soldier dying because of his wounds, surrounded by his comrades. At the last moment he smiles. http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x1s0jz_martyr-tchetchene_creation

I'm not here to blame about the Jews or the West or X or M. This question is about this very specific phenomenon, not for doing religious propaganda or geopolitical one.

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General Discussions / ISIS soldier dying and smiling ?

« on: June 02, 2016, 09:23:02 AM »

You maybe have heard about the Palestinian martyrs, who supposedly die with a smile in their face.

I do not know if it is true. I saw many photos about it, but maybe the smiles aren't a really ones, maybe the're just a coincidence or a specific pain in the last moment.

However, I saw an ISIS soldier with smile in the face at the moment of his death.

Did this guy dead in martyr? If not, why his smile?

What do you think about this phenomenon?

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General Discussions / Re: HIKMA means indeed HADITHS and not WISDOM

« on: May 27, 2016, 06:11:26 AM »

I believe this is the last time I am replying to you! We have very different approach towards thinking about religion and logic! I am convinced we will never see eye to eye! God bless!

GOD - there is no deity save Him, the Ever-Living, the Self-Subsistent Fount of All Being. Neither slumber overtakes Him, nor sleep. His is all that is in the heavens and all that is on earth. Who is there that could intercede with Him, unless it be by His leave? He knows all that lies open before men and all that is hidden from them, whereas they cannot attain to aught of His knowledge save that which He wills [them to attain]. His eternal power overspreads the heavens and the earth, and their upholding wearies Him not. And he alone is truly exalted, tremendous. http://islamawakened.com/quran/2/255/

I do not see contradiction in that the Prophet could be allowed to know the future and then people write down his prophecies. However, Nora, I'm not afraid.

It is only the logic. This verse confirm that this isn't a contradiction: this very verse not confirm the truth of the Ahadith but it don't deny too. It open the door to many possibilities.

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General Discussions / Re: HIKMA means indeed HADITHS and not WISDOM

« on: May 27, 2016, 04:14:47 AM »

Salam ZKAB90

Aleikum salam Nura.

Have u seen the future? No, it is unseen. However, Muhammad foretold many things.

That So the Quran was not saying prophet knew when the end will come

Not only the Qur'an! The Ahadith saying the same thing, i.e. that he doesn't know when the world will be end, but he gave many signs about.

I know the truth is hard to swallow... Again, checkmate.

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General Discussions / Re: HIKMA means indeed HADITHS and not WISDOM

« on: May 26, 2016, 10:28:57 PM »

Aleikum salam Hassan;

You say that Ahadith are not Hikmah with discutable points.

As I told you the prophecies are the greatest points to approve it. Then, you respond telling me that Muhammad could not know about the future... However this verse I think it will defintely break your argument. Look:

[He is] Knower of the unseen, and He does not disclose His [knowledge of the] unseen to anyone http://quran.com/72/26

Except whom He has approved of messengers, and indeed, He sends before each messenger and behind him observers http://quran.com/72/27

Checkmate.

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General Discussions / Re: HIKMA means indeed HADITHS and not WISDOM

« on: May 26, 2016, 05:30:35 AM »

The Qur’an was clearly revealed at the time of Muhammad for, as Truth Seeker says, to be relevant for the context of Muhammad.

So now it is not relevant according to you?

Thinking in this way is counter-productive for the correct development of the religion. But maybe the Qur'an-centric position, and specially the contextualization of the Qur'an in a specific time-space lead to deny the validity of the Qur'an until the Last Day.

According to orthodox school of thought, this kind of thought is clear Bid'ah, a heretic thought.

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General Discussions / Re: HIKMA means indeed HADITHS and not WISDOM

« on: May 25, 2016, 04:03:04 AM »

It is very clear when in the Quran, God is asking the belivers to obey the prophet, it is referring to those people around him in his lifetime !
The prophet is their leader and commander in chief and they must
of course follow and trust in him and his commands.

Aleikum salam,


Are you trying to say indirectly that the Qur'an is created, i.e. that is destined only for a specific time, like the time of Muhammad, and not this time in which we are living now?

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General Discussions / Re: HIKMA means indeed HADITHS and not WISDOM

« on: May 14, 2016, 08:35:09 AM »

Salam Hassan,

I find good rebuttal to you. Read carefully please, there are 3 proofs:


PROOF N°1

Abū Ruquyah Farasat Latif, in his “The Qur’aniyūn of the twentieth century”, [http://www.academia.edu/3452285/The_Quraniy%C5%ABn_Of_The_Twentieth_Century] in page 43 says:

“The Qur’aniyūn reject the orthodox Islamic position which equates the word ‘Hikmah’ in some of the Qur’anic verses to mean ‘sunna’ I will demonstrate that the Hikmah mentioned in the Qur’an does, in a number of verses, refer to the sunna. A number of verses prove this:”

The he gives these verses: 4:113, 2:231, 2:129, 2:151, 3:164, 33:34, 62:2

In all these verses there is the conjuction “wa” [“and”], so he conclude that

“Shafi’I explain that the letter ‘wa’ (meaning ‘and’) between Book and Hikmah in the verses above is:

<<a letter of conjunction in Arabic which requires that the two parts it joins must be different otherwise the sentence will be redundant>>

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

PROOF N°2

Again, Abū Ruquyah Farasat Latif, in the cited work, in page 54, the section “Methods used by the Companions to preserve the Sunna” gives some methods:

i) Memorisation, because “The Arabs were renowned for their powerful memories. It has been scientifically proven that the constant use of a certain human faculty makes it more responsive. The early Arabs paid great attention to their memories and developed this to its highest point”

ii) Recollection of hadith

iii) Practice, because “The Companions were keen to implement everything they had learnt. Their daily routines such as worship, dress, food, personal hygiene, family relations, business, travel and so on, were based upon the sunna. Continual practice of the sunna ensured its preservation”

iv) Asking questions to one another

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

PROOF N°3


Millions of people, in the last 14 centuries, have prayed and asked to Allah for their guidance. Now, a little school of thought, the Qur’aniyūn, make takfir over millions and millions of people. Amazing...

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General Discussions / Re: PROOFS we are living the End Times and MAHDI (and DAJJAL) will appears shortly

« on: May 10, 2016, 07:18:02 AM »

Furthermore, in this thread HIKMA means indeed HADITHS and not WISDOM http://quransmessage.com/forum/index.php?topic=1918.0 I posted a good rebuttal, in my opinion, took from a Sunni web.

This explain the obligatory to follow the Sunna.

So, we have two points for the Ahadith:

1/ Follow the Sunna of the Prophet [and in this thread I posted the link to the 19 quranic quotes that requires us to follow the Sunna, so you won't be able to say me that I only focuse to the Ahadith and disregard the Qu'ran]

2/ The Qu'ran was compiled by the same people who memorized [and some written down] the acts and sayings of the Prophet. Amazing, isn't?

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General Discussions / Re: HIKMA means indeed HADITHS and not WISDOM

« on: May 10, 2016, 07:08:16 AM »

Does the Quran wish us to follow the Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him)? Yes.

This should be enough evidence. “(O Muhammad, to mankind): if ye love Allah, follow me; Allah will love you and forgive you your sins. Allah is Forgiving, merciful.” Ahl-Imran 3, Verse 31

There are nineteen times that obedience of the Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) is stated in the Quran by Allah Subhanu wa ta’ala

source: http://sectarianrefutations.blogspot.be/2007/02/refutation-of-group-tolu-e-islam.html

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

In the page you will able to read the 19 Quranic citations that, in my opinion, reinforce the fact that we must follow, if not all the Ahadith, surely some of them.

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General Discussions / Re: PROOFS we are living the End Times and MAHDI (and DAJJAL) will appears shortly

« on: May 10, 2016, 07:04:31 AM »

No one has said that truth is only contained in the Quran. Snippets of truth can be found in newspapers, books, magazines or any source of information. But that is not revelation. There is a difference.

I pasting right now a critique to Quran-alone school by the followers of the Ahadith:

The mode by which the Qur'aan was transmitted is the same as the way in which the Ahadeeth were transmitted - from generation to generation. The individuals who transmitted the Qur'aan were the same who have transmitted the hadeeth. To accept one and reject the other defies reason. Moreover, the Qur'aanic promise of protection must apply to Hadeeth as well for there is no point in protecting the words but not the interpretation.

It isn't about the truth of Ahadith, it isn't about the contradictions in the Ahadith [or alleged, because you know the mental gymnastic that Sunnis doing to fit them] that trouble me. The fear is well summarized in the red quote I posted.

Who guarantee that the Qu'ran we have is the Real one? Because of scientific miracles or the numerical ones? What guarantee us that this Qu'ran is complete?. The fact that Allah say that He protect it doesn't means that this sentence can't be added by people whow write down it to make more certain that is the complete one.

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General Discussions / Re: PROOFS we are living the End Times and MAHDI (and DAJJAL) will appears shortly

« on: May 10, 2016, 04:57:31 AM »

Because either the prophet knew or he did not.

I understand your position. Words are importants and if the Prophet knowed it by hitself or by another revelation, this is the difference.

However I'm more interested in the "punishment in the grave" topic that the Ahadith.

It was just for showing that some Hadith can be vague but maybe, at the same time, correct.