7:172-173

[yahya]

Assalam alikum brother I was wondering if you could explain 7:172-173 please in quran because it makes it sound like that athiests and pagans will go to hell no matter what even if they didt hear the meassege of islam in a correct way but then what would be the point of sending messagesers because god said that he doesn't punish anyone until he sends a measseger so it's very confusing so if you could get back to me that would be great and ramadan karrem

[deleted]

7:172-173 don't state but that we've all testified that "He is our Lord alone", that's it. Do you think you need messengers from your Lord to think know "He is our Lord alone"?? ("He" as in how He's described in the book.) If you don't, then don't you think that all people have seen enough of the message to know "He is our Lord alone"?

[yahya]

Assalam alikum but these verses make it sound like that every budist and athiest and Hindu and pagan every non monotheistic faith are all kafir rejecting the truthful because these verses make it sound like there's no excuse to believe in a god and in one god not more or less etc if you know what I mean jazzakkallah

[Truth Seeker]

Salaam Yahya,

Joseph has written a very comprehensive article titled:

'Understanding Kufr (Disbelief) from an Quranic Perspective'

http://quransmessage.com/articles/understanding%20kufr%20FM3.htm

I hope it helps you IA.

[munir rana]

Dear Yahya
Salam

Let it be to God to judge who are what- mumin, mushrik, kafir etc. We should follow relligion  according our understanding. Its not our responsibility for others matter. So let us not judge anyone else. This judgmental approach in the end creates fitnah which some muslim countries are experiencing badly.

Who says that every Hindu is kafir. Do you know about Brahmo. They are monotheist Hindu. Their are unitarian Christians and many others. So let us not be judgemental. Even we do not know the inner view of every Hindu Buddhist etc who we seem to be a kafir. Only God knows. On the contrary a muslim-like folk can be mushrik in their relligious aproaches. Many from muslim community praise the prophet and other imams saints as His partner. How they can be different from a hindu worshiper of Devis, which we call mushrik?

Please read the following post by Brother Joseph. Hope it will help.

http://www.quransmessage.com/articles/understanding%20kufr%20FM3.htm

[yahya]

I know the meaning of the word kafir and I already agree with the article what I'm meaning is that these 2 verses make it sound like there is no excuse not to believe in a god and that everyone who is non monotheistic is a kafir witch I know are not but the verse make it sound like that meaning that all athiests know that there is a god and that every pagan knows there is just one god mean they are all arrogantly rejecting the truth but I know allah are not but what I'm saying is these verse make it sound that way etc if you know what I mean jazzakkallah

[ilker]

Dear Yahya
Salam

Let it be to God to judge who are what- mumin, mushrik, kafir etc. We should follow relligion  according our understanding. Its not our responsibility for others matter. So let us not judge anyone else. This judgmental approach in the end creates fitnah which some muslim countries are experiencing badly.

Who says that every Hindu is kafir. Do you know about Brahmo. They are monotheist Hindu. Their are unitarian Christians and many others. So let us not be judgemental. Even we do not know the inner view of every Hindu Buddhist etc who we seem to be a kafir. Only God knows. On the contrary a muslim-like folk can be mushrik in their relligious aproaches. Many from muslim community praise the prophet and other imams saints as His partner. How they can be different from a hindu worshiper of Devis, which we call mushrik?

Please read the following post by Brother Joseph. Hope it will help.

http://www.quransmessage.com/articles/understanding%20kufr%20FM3.htm

Salam.

I agree that we can't judge a person cause we don't know what is inside the heart.

You talk about Hindus and Christians etc. Now there are lots of questions that can be asked about them. Assuming that they have enough knowledge about the message of Islam... Do they believe in Allah ? Do they accept all His messengers or reject some of them ? DO they recognize Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) as one of His messengers? Do they accept Quran as the word of Allah ? Who do they worship to ? What are the qualifications that they attritube to the God they believe ?

Quran rejects false religions... (3:85)

"The Messenger has believed in what was revealed to him from his Lord, and [so have] the believers. All of them have believed in Allah and His angels and His books and His messengers, [saying], "We make no distinction between any of His messengers." And they say, "We hear and we obey. [We seek] Your forgiveness, our Lord, and to You is the [final] destination." (2:285)

[munir rana]

Dear ilker
Salam

Would please read the article by Brother Joseph and then put forward your opinion about it. 

http://www.quransmessage.com/articles/muslim%20mumin%20FM3.htm

Regards.

[ilker]

Salam

I've read the article but how is it relevant to this topic and what i asked ? I'm not talking about muslim and mu'min difference. I'm asking these questions about "kufr"and "monotheism" you speak of. You said:

"Do you know about Brahmo. They are monotheist Hindu. Their are unitarian Christians and many others."

I'm simply asking that from a Quranic perspective is their "monotheism" valid and "Islamic" because Quran rejects false religions (3:85).

http://quransmessage.com/forum/index.php?topic=1247.msg5793#msg5793

2:285 is about mumineen and what they believe. And I can't say hindu or christians are all the same, especially about the People of the Book, while ALLAH says the opposite:

They are not [all] the same; among the People of the Scripture is a community standing [in obedience], reciting the verses of Allah during periods of the night and prostrating [in prayer].   (3:113)

[munir rana]

Salam.

As per my understanding  and according to Quran anyone is monotheist who submits to the One Allah and do good to others is a Muslim. Here it must be clear that the name 'Allah' is only an Arabic name for God. It is not an exclusive name for God.

(please see the related article by Brother Joseph : http://www.quransmessage.com/articles/allah%20is%20not%20an%20exclusive%20name%20for%20god%20FM3.htm)

As Brother Joseph also wrote in the article I recomended earlier:

"Muslims are those that submit their will to God and can be from the followers of the previous messengers and scriptures (Jews and Christians included)"

And in another article titled WHY IS THE TERM 'MUSLIM' HIJACKED Brother Joseph also wrote:

"From a Quran's perspective, even Jews and Christians can be 'Muslim's if they have solely surrendered their purpose to God. The term believers (Mu'min) is used predominantly for the followers and believers in the final scripture (Quran). Some of these can be from the People of the Book as well.  Please see article (2) below and in particular section (17) entitled "THERE ARE 'BELIEVERS' AMONG THE PEOPLE OF THE BOOK".

In conclusion, a Christian or a Jew may be a 'Muslim' but not necessarily a believer or in the case where they believe in the veracity of the Quran, they may be a Muslim and a believer, but choose to follow their own laws (Shariah) revealed to them in their respective scriptures."
(link: http://www.quransmessage.com/articles/term%20muslim%20hijacked%20FM3.htm)


Now,
So far as I know, Brahmo Hindu or Unitarian Christians and many others like them are monotheist, means, they submit to One God and does not set any partner with Him.

Unitarianism is historically a Christian theological movement named for the affirmation that God is one entity, in direct contrast to Trinitarianism, which defines God as three persons in one being.
(https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unitarianism)

Brahmo is a monotheistic religion also, It denounces polytheism, image worship, and the caste system. They don't set any partners with God.
(https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brahmoism)

Please see also the the follwing article :
http://quransmessage.com/articles/people%20of%20the%20book%20FM3.htm

Hope, I made my point clear.

Thanks.