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Offline HOPE

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58:12 charity vs truthfulness
« on: December 31, 2017, 01:35:32 AM »
Peace,

58:12  O you who believe! When you (want to) consult the Messenger in private, spend something in charity before your private consultation.

58:13  Are you afraid of spending in charity before your private consultation (with him)? If then you do it not, and Allah has forgiven you, then (at least) perform As-Salat and give Zakat and obey Allah

9:60 charities are for the poor the needy, those who collect, those in debt, freeing slaves, those in the way of Allah, wayfarer

36:21 follow those men who do not ask you any payment


why sadaka is required before private consultation with the Prophet?

SDQ is the opposite of  KZB = to lie, to disclaim

sadaqa  means to be truthful, to fulfill
to accept truth, to admit, to confirm, to believe
to give charity

taṣdīq muṣaddiq

 why not use the other meanings?

Before scheduling a meeting in private show your sincerity, truthfulness  This has universal meaning.  But if ulterior motives are in play then 58:13 makes sense

Hope

"Hope is like a bird that senses the dawn and carefully starts to sing while it is still dark"

Offline Hamzeh

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Re: 58:12 charity vs truthfulness
« Reply #1 on: December 31, 2017, 04:15:31 PM »
Peace sister Hope


Not sure if I get the message but I am assuming you are suggesting that in this context the term "sadaqatan" means  or could mean truthfulness/sincerity?

If so verse 58:12 would suggest that God is somewhat forgiving for those who do not show any sincerity or truthfulness to the messenger. I find that kinda odd if the option is given to do so or not to do so by the phrase(But if you find not...). As there is verses in the Quran that expect believers to show lots of respect and act differently around the messenger of God than they would around each other and of course to always be truthful.

58:12  O you who believe! When you (want to) consult the Messenger in private, spend something in charity before your private consultation.That will be best for you, and most conducive to purity (of conduct). But if ye find not (the wherewithal), Allah is Oft-Forgiving, Most Merciful.[/color]


An interpolation of the verses is that if anyone was meeting with the messenger in private, take something of charity with you(possibly the prophet was one who holds a charity). That is better and purer for the person. But however if they could not or do not have the means God is Oft-Forgiving, Most Merciful.

Then in 58:13 God asks are you reluctant to offer charity before your conversation? If you do not do so(because the said person might not be able to, does not have the wealth), and God pardons you, then pray and pay the dues(zakat) and obey God and His messenger. God is aware of what you do.

Those are my thoughts

Salam

Offline HOPE

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Re: 58:12 charity vs truthfulness
« Reply #2 on: January 01, 2018, 06:11:05 AM »
Peace br. Hamzeh in 2018,

It has been said that Sadaqa can even be a smile, something not tangible, like truth.  I was thinking of material goods because of the following verse yet it does not make sense to me.  If I cannot afford the voluntary sadaqah, how am I going to pay the zakat for not paying the sadaqah?

Thanks for responding 
"Hope is like a bird that senses the dawn and carefully starts to sing while it is still dark"

Offline Duster

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Re: 58:12 charity vs truthfulness
« Reply #3 on: January 01, 2018, 06:44:37 AM »
Shalom / peace Hope .... A thought ... given that the prophet was always engaged in preaching and administering the affairs of the Ummah in some way, do you think any income from charitable donations from private consultations would be a problem?? He didn't ask for a fee nor was it a prerequisite or a condition for him to be able to see someone privately ... it was only a charitable donation if people wanted to donate ....


Offline HOPE

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Re: 58:12 charity vs truthfulness
« Reply #4 on: January 01, 2018, 06:55:53 AM »
This is Muhammad Asad’s tafseer

This call to an exercise of charity on every occasion (bayna yaday) of one's "consultation" with God’s Apostle has been widely misunderstood as applying only to factual consultations with him, i.e., in his lifetime, supposedly with a view to lessening the encroachments on his time by some of his too-eager followers. This misunderstanding, together with the qualified dispensation from the above-mentioned injunction expressed in the next verse, has given rise to the unwarranted contention by some of the commentators that this injunction has been "abrogated". But apart from the fact that the theory of "abrogation" as such is entirely untenable, the above verse reveals its true meaning as soon as we realize that the term "the Apostle" (ar-rasul) is used in the Qur'an not merely to designate the unique person of the Prophet Muhammad but also the sum-total of the teachings conveyed by him to the world.

This is evident from the many Qur’anic exhortations, "Pay heed unto God and the Apostle", and, more specifically (in 4:59), "if you are at variance over any matter, refer it unto God [i.e., the Qur'an) and the Apostle [i.e., his sunnah]", which latter is but meant to elucidate the former. Taken in this sense, the above reference to a "consultation with the Apostle" obviously applies not only to his person and his contemporaries, but rather to his teachings in general and to believers of all times and environments. In other words, every believer is exhorted to "offer up something in charity" - whether it be material alms to a needy person, or the imparting of knowledge to such as may be in need of enlightenment, or even a mere word of kindness to a
weak human being - whenever he intends to immerse himself in a study of the Apostle’s teachings or, as the Qur'an phrases it, to "consult" him who has conveyed the divine writ to us.
Lit., "if you do not find", sc., anyone on whom to bestow charity at that particular moment, or have - for whatever reason - no opportunity to exercise it. I.e., the obligatory tax (zakah) which is meant to purify a believer's possessions and income from the taint of selfishness: implying that one's inability to do more by way of charity does not constitute a sin.
"Hope is like a bird that senses the dawn and carefully starts to sing while it is still dark"

Offline Hamzeh

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Re: 58:12 charity vs truthfulness
« Reply #5 on: January 01, 2018, 09:14:13 AM »
Peace sister Hope

Quote
If I cannot afford the voluntary sadaqah, how am I going to pay the zakat for not paying the sadaqah?

Thats a good thought and question. I think when one understand the concepts of both "Zakat" and "Sadaqat" in this view it would be easily understandable to capture what is meant in verses 58:12-13

Below is an article by brother Joseph explaining the differences in case you did not read it.[1]

How would one be able to pay zakat if one is not able to pay sadaqah? Putting for an example might help Insha'Allah. Lets say you:

bought a car for $1000.
Then sold it in one year for $2000.
Profit is $1000.

A community(those in authority) would have to develop some rules and rates for what is needed to be paid by those living in the community/nation under the constitution.

If the rate of Zakat is determined to be 20% then the Zakat that needs to be paid is $200 from the profit of the car.

Lets say a person did this once a month. That leaves them with $800 to live.

This maybe enough or not enough for some people. Anything spent from the $800(sadaqah charity) is optional and very encouraged especially if it is more than enough to live.

If one has a family and only makings ends meet then one might not be able to give anything in charity/sadaqah.

Therefor I find the verses is asking that if anyone cannot give in charity keep up paying the zakat(dues).

Thank you for sharing the other opinions as well.

I also agree with brother Duster that:
Quote
given that the prophet was always engaged in preaching and administering the affairs of the Ummah in some way, do you think any income from charitable donations from private consultations would be a problem??

It could be also that he was administering/operating a charity which would not be any profit to him. This would then go to the poor, needy, those who collect etc.

Insha'Allah you all have a blessed and happy new years  :)


WHAT IS THE CONCEPT OF ZAKAT FROM THE QURAN?
http://quransmessage.com/articles/zakah%20FM3.htm

Salam