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Offline Beyond Tradition

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Death pain in Qurans perspective
« on: April 14, 2019, 04:06:33 AM »
Dear Brother Joseph
As- salamualikum . I always hankering after your input of my any topics. I hope if you get time you
Will input your thought on my said topics.

Many Scolars , many Muslims try to measure the death pain or pain at the point of death. My philosophy or judgement based on Quran death is a normal phenomenon for human life. So far I know I did not find that Quran says anything about the pain at the point of death. It will come on a sudden and take away the soul of human being and will enter in Barjakh where time concept is lost. I never find or never heard that God describes about the pain at the death point . He alarms only to fear the Day of resurction and hell fire where severe pain of fire is waiting . But now many muslim scholar and in Islami secondary sources states that prophet Mohammad discribed the pain at his death point and sought to all mighty some waive of pain to his followers. Per Islami secondary sources prophet Mohammad has been given a extreme less of pain what he was not bearing and was thinking for his
followers how they will bear this death pain. Where prophet himself received death with a very cordial
process by angel of death but it was so severe than his followers will receive 100 times severe than Prophet Mohammad (Pbuh). My question in earthly capacity men can die within a second like in explosive , in gun point etc... so how this life suffer severe pain at the point of death. Moreover , why God will give  someone severe pain based on his bad deeds in the earth. If so then without trial how God can apply severe death pain to a men ? Pls input your thought .

Offline Beyond Tradition

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Re: Death pain in Qurans perspective
« Reply #1 on: April 16, 2019, 07:28:59 PM »
Dear Brother Joseph
As- salamualikum . Hope you had no patience to read my long topics . I apologize you if you bother for that . Actually I could not fix how to ask you my question  and if I not stated elaborately you may not understand my question .
So please see my ultimate question on this topic.

My question in earthly capacity men can die within a second like in explosive , in gun point etc... so how this life suffer severe pain at the point of death. Moreover , why God will give  someone severe pain based on his bad deeds in the earth. If so then without trial how God can apply severe death pain to a men ? Pls input your thought .

Offline Truth Seeker

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Re: Death pain in Qurans perspective
« Reply #2 on: April 16, 2019, 08:14:40 PM »
Salaam Beyond Tradition,

Quote
My question in earthly capacity men can die within a second like in explosive , in gun point etc... so how this life suffer severe pain at the point of death. Moreover , why God will give  someone severe pain based on his bad deeds in the earth. If so then without trial how God can apply severe death pain to a men ? Pls input your thought .

To clarify, are you asking that if a person is to die in a severely painful way, why God did that to them because it seems like a punishment before they have even reached judgement?

Offline Beyond Tradition

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Re: Death pain in Qurans perspective
« Reply #3 on: April 17, 2019, 04:15:45 AM »
Yes . It is prevailing that death pain is so severe and has a grade . For example prophets got less pain but in Islami secondary sources said it was also so severe . So per Islami secondery  sources we general people should receive more severe pain than Prophet . It is also said a prophet ( can not remember name) asked Angel of death in paradise how he took away his soul the reason Prophet got severe pain at the death point. Angel said it was his best to give less pain to Prophet so far he took away the lives of the people. According to Hadiths wrong doers must face optimum level of death pain and rightious will receive less pain . But a minimum pain is compulsory for all.

My question actually is that why death pain will have grade ? I never hear from Quran such type of grading of pain.  I believe according to Quran before Day of Judgement nobody will not be declared
Rightious or wrong doers so why God will apply the pain to a person less or severe . Hope you got my point .

Offline Beyond Tradition

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Re: Death pain in Qurans perspective
« Reply #4 on: April 18, 2019, 06:06:41 PM »
Is any body in this forum available  to make me clear on this topics ?

Offline Truth Seeker

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Re: Death pain in Qurans perspective
« Reply #5 on: April 18, 2019, 08:26:06 PM »
Salaam,

Quote
My question actually is that why death pain will have grade ? I never hear from Quran such type of grading of pain.  I believe according to Quran before Day of Judgement nobody will not be declared
Rightious or wrong doers so why God will apply the pain to a person less or severe . Hope you got my point .

You are right when you say that there is nothing in the Quran regarding the examples you gave about severe pain etc at the time of death.
If you take the Quran as being the only authority, then it makes life so much simpler as you will not see any contradictions. The hadith you mention will obviously cause confusion in this matter because they are at odds with what the Quran says.

It is God's will and only He has the wisdom behind what type and severity of death a person will receive.

Offline Truth Seeker

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Re: Death pain in Qurans perspective
« Reply #6 on: April 18, 2019, 09:12:29 PM »
Also a point to note though is at the moment of death, a person will be aware of the truth if he was a sinner or disbeliever during his life. His/her punishment though will be given on the Day Of Judgement.


"And of no effect is the repentance of those who continue to do evil deeds until death faces one of them and he says: 'Now I repent' Nor of those who die while they are disbeliever's. For them we have prepared a painful torment." [Quran 4:18]


"When angels take the souls of those who die in sin against their souls, they say: "In what (plight) Were ye?" They reply: "Weak and oppressed Were we in the earth." They say: "Was not the earth of Allah spacious enough for you to move yourselves away (From evil)?" Such men will find their abode in Hell,- What an evil refuge!" [Quran 4:97]

Offline Beyond Tradition

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Re: Death pain in Qurans perspective
« Reply #7 on: April 19, 2019, 04:48:38 AM »
Brother truth seeker ,
Salamun Alaikum . I thank you to have your valued thought .
You quoted a few verse . I honestly disagree  of the knowing truth at the death point.
According to Quran all the believers and non believers will say that who raised us ?
The Day all will remember that God promised . So my humble opinion that nobody will know the truth until they are raised at the Day of resurrection. In any verse when God says “ they will know soon “
It indicate the Day . Because after death when all will be raised everybody will tell that they just left the earth like a dawn or half of the day though there has been passed million or billion of years. That is why God says in the Quran “ they will know soon “ . If you think I am mistaking wrong in my belief please make me correct immediately in Quran’s perspective.

Offline Joseph Islam

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Re: Death pain in Qurans perspective
« Reply #8 on: April 20, 2019, 03:49:01 AM »
Dear Beyond Tradition,

As-salamu alaykum

The Quran appears to suggest that there are two broad parts to the dying process:

1. The experience of death itself which is described as 'ghamrah' [6:93] (an agony, anguish, grief, a perplexity) [50:19] and 'sakrah' (dazzlement and an agony of death).
2. Some degree of awareness during the death-stroke of:

(a) That this life was indeed only a trial for the next. This has been cited through the examples of wrong-doers in particular (4:18; 4:97; 23:99-100).
(b) The dying soul will have some awareness of those charged to extract the soul from their body (4:97; 6:93) [the angel(s) of death].

Now just because there is 1. An experience of death and 2. An awareness of purpose at the death stroke, this does not mean that a soul cannot be put to rest and awoken at the Day of Judgement and yet still feel that only a moment has lapsed.

These are not mutually exclusive concepts. The 'momentary time lapse' indicated by the Quran merely signifies that after the soul is put to death, the concept of time is totally lost in the state of Barzakh (23:100). This is depicted in numerous verses such as 17:52, 30:55-56, 10:45, 56:35, 79:46

Of course, the full extent of the truth and one's accountability will only be manifested on the Day of Judgement. In that regards, your insinuation is absolutely correct. As you may already know, I do not subscribe to the concept that there is any punishment during one’s presence in the grave [1] and thus, from the moment of death and one's arrival on the Day of Judgement, it will only feel like a 'blinking / twinkling of an eye' (16:77).

I hope this helps, God willing

Regards,
Joseph


REFERENCE

[1] PUNISHMENT OF THE GRAVE (AZAB-E-QABR)
http://quransmessage.com/articles/grave%20punishment%20FM3.htm
'During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act' 
George Orwell