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Offline chadiga

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« on: November 27, 2011, 09:31:40 PM »
Salamu Aleikum

Is compliance with the Islamic lunar calendar year to really as prescribed in the Quran? If we consider the corresponding verses, we see that is clearly defined by the Koran, only the number of months in the year. That for the determination of the monthly beginning the evidence is decisive, is found neither in the Qur'an . It is just mentioned, that the new Moon was instrumental for the determination of the pilgrimage.
Here are the verses:

"Twelve God considers to be the right number of months. It is in the Scriptures of God already in the day that he created heaven and earth, laid down were are these, four are sacred. This is the right religion. Transgressors now in them (the four sacred months) are not you against yourself, and fight all against the heathens, as they fight for their part against you. You must know that God is with those who fear him. The shifts (the calendar order through an intercalary month) is an excess of disbelief . Those who are already on in disbelief, are therefore misled more. you explain the (month) of Muharram in the year (ie in a leap year) for the profane, in another (ie in a normal year) to be sacred to the number of what God has said in months for holy (namely four) to equal (and not about five months to declare holy), and (to the other) to declare profane for what God has declared holy (namely the Muharram) . The evil that they do show themselves in their best light. God does not guide the disbelieving people fairly. " [Quran 9, 36 - 37]

"He (God) is the one who made the sun for brightness (day) and the moon to light (at night) stations and determined for him, so that you know about the number of years and the reckoning of time modest. In succession of day and night and in what God has created in heaven and on earth lie, signs for those who are righteous. " [Quran 10.6]

"The sun and the moon are used for calculation (the time)." (Quran 55.5)
"They ask thee concerning the new moons. Say: They are (by God as a set) fixed times for mankind and for pilgrimage." [Qur'an 2, 189]

It can be interpreted as a sign, if we find mentioned in the Koran is the word Yaum * day * 365 times and the word * Shahr Month 12 times?
Would not it be possible that would be a God-given order as a form of Gregoran calendar that knows no leap months, only a leap Day  in four years? It may not be the pre-Islamic Arabs accused that they had no idea of ​​calendar calculation, on the contrary, they had to rely on a good run-the year custom-Kalender. see also
The names of the Arabic months give us also a evidence, so as Ramadan *hot* and Rabia *spring?* , Zu-al-Hijja and Muharram for pilgrimage what took place in the rainfall-period.

Thank you for your help

Offline Truth Seeker

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Re: mooncalender
« Reply #1 on: November 29, 2011, 03:52:37 AM »

I am not sure what you are specifically asking. Are you saying that the Quran is telling us to follow the solar calendar?

Offline chadiga

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Re: mooncalender
« Reply #2 on: November 29, 2011, 04:38:37 AM »
I wonder if the moon calendar is, how it is implemented today in Islam, by Allah willed . maybe a demi solar-lunar-system.  Sorry my Enlish ist very bad .This is a problem, i can't tell, what i meen...

Offline Joseph Islam

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Re: mooncalender
« Reply #3 on: November 29, 2011, 10:10:58 AM »
Salamun Alaikum Chadiga,

The purpose of any calendar is to understand and to mark time. The Quran recognises different calendar systems.

For example in Surah 18:25, we note some people that said:

"And they remained in their Cave (for) three hundred years, and (some) add nine"

The difference of 9 years noted between 300 and 309 years, is the difference between a solar and a lunar calendar.
However, the Quran informs believers what the new moons are for and they are not just for pilgrimage.

Verse 2:189 says they are:

     (a) To mark the months of pilgrimage and
     (b) To mark periods for mankind (mawaqitu-linasi)

If you note, 2:189 follows the verses about fasting. Therefore by implication, even fasting would be determined by new moons.

Hence, new moons have been suggested as indicators for mankind not only for determining key events (like Ramadan and Hajj) but also for general time calculation as well.

According to the Quran, the 12 month system (based on lunar months) is recognised, four of which are sacred (9:36). This is referred to as the correct 'deen' (system).

I feel that whenever we sincerely attempt to understand Quranic narratives, that we keep its context and immediate audience in view. This helps give us a better perspective.

For example, the Arabs of the desert had no recourse to digital watches or modern technology. Therefore, the Quran spoke to its primary audience with what was available to them. Much in the same way, the Quran was talking to the Arabs with the months they recognised. It was not teaching them how to name their months but informed them of key events to note given the name of the months they knew.

'Ramd' does mean hot, scorching heat or intense heat felt on the ground, but many months in the year are hot in the middle of the desert. I personally wouldn't look too much into the literal meanings of the month other than these were months that the Arabs recognised and the Quran merely made use of them to make the message clear.

Furthermore, I am a little bit confused with the translation you are using. For example, you say:

"The sun and the moon are used for calculation (the time)." (Quran 55.5)

This is not what the verse says. The verse says:

"shamsu wal-qamru bi'husbaan"

'Generally' when a preposition 'bi' is attached to a noun in this way as in 'bi'husbaan', it  indicates 'by' or 'using'.  It implies that something A is using something B.

As a crude example: To say bi-taayara means 'using' or 'by' a plane (taayara) as in 'I'm travelling 'by' plane' or 'I'm travelling 'using' a plane'

Therefore, the verse seems to be saying that the sun and the moon are 'using' a calculation which indicates to me that the sun and moon follow a certain course, or some sort of fixed calculation.

This does not mean that the sun and moon are 'used' for calculation.

So yes, I personally feel the Quran is marking key events and indicating use of a lunar calendar system of 12 months to identify these events. (correct deen) However, I don't think this amounts to a prohibition of any other calendar system. This is as long as key Islamic events are noted and used in the months they occurred based on the 12 month lunar calendar.

I suppose this is no different than the system that we make use of today.

I hope this helps, God willing.

'During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act' 
George Orwell