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Offline ilker

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the word "hamr" in 47:15
« on: February 25, 2017, 08:21:09 PM »
Salamun alaykum

First, I must say I did search 47:15 in the forum but i couldn't find a solid explanation in terms of grammar and coherence with other ayat that contain the word "hamr". Why do you think Allah(swt) uses this word for a river of "nonintoxicating" drink (56:19) in Jannah in 47:15 ?

I'm a little bit confused about this because i knew that the word "hamr" comes from the root of "to cover, to conceal" ,so it describes any kind of fluid which makes you drunk.

(I would also like to know what brother Joseph thinks about this ayah)

Offline Joseph Islam

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Re: the word "hamr" in 47:15
« Reply #1 on: February 26, 2017, 12:12:50 AM »
Dear Ilker,

Wa alaikum assalam

The Quran made best use of an existing language / vernacular of the Arabs to make an argument clear. It was / is arguably not interested in root analysis and etymologies or of making use of words which don’t carry the most obvious nuance intended for that particular context. 

'Khamar' is a well-known noun meaning wine. It refers to the liquid (2:219; 5:90-91; 12:41) or process of making wine (12:36).

However, the Quran also goes out of its way to clarify that this particular 'wine' will not intoxicate (56:19).

I hope this helps, God willing
Joseph
'During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act' 
George Orwell

Offline Deliverance

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Re: the word "hamr" in 47:15
« Reply #2 on: February 26, 2017, 06:10:05 PM »
The arabs liked wine so much that it was hard to forbade them drinking wine at once ,so they had to be abstinated from it bit by bit.First they were adviced not to come drunken to salat,then it is told that there is god and bad Things in khamar but the bad Things overweight it so leave it is ordered ,and the last stage was that wine is satanic.

Offline Duster

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Re: the word "hamr" in 47:15
« Reply #3 on: February 26, 2017, 06:36:25 PM »
The arabs liked wine so much that it was hard to forbade them drinking wine at once ,so they had to be abstinated from it bit by bit.First they were adviced not to come drunken to salat,then it is told that there is god and bad Things in khamar but the bad Things overweight it so leave it is ordered ,and the last stage was that wine is satanic.

Shalom / peace. A little confused.  What has this got to do with the opening post???

Offline ilker

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Re: the word "hamr" in 47:15
« Reply #4 on: February 26, 2017, 07:17:46 PM »
Dear Ilker,

Wa alaikum assalam

The Quran made best use of an existing language / vernacular of the Arabs to make an argument clear. It was / is arguably not interested in root analysis and etymologies or of making use of words which don’t carry the most obvious nuance intended for that particular context. 

'Khamar' is a well-known noun meaning wine. It refers to the liquid (2:219; 5:90-91; 12:41) or process of making wine (12:36).

However, the Quran also goes out of its way to clarify that this particular 'wine' will not intoxicate (56:19).

I hope this helps, God willing
Joseph

salam

Alhamdulillah. Thanks for your reply :) JazakAllah khair. Dear Deliverance thanks for your contribution, but i was trying to learn about something else. Peace Duster.

Offline Deliverance

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Re: the word "hamr" in 47:15
« Reply #5 on: February 26, 2017, 08:02:22 PM »
@duster

What i wanted to say is that because the arabs liked drinking wine the quran uses the Image of wine in the hereafter as well so that they can be familiar with the place in heaven ,maybe ?.