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Offline Adil Husain

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Do we have a 'free-will' or Allah decides whatever we do ?
« on: January 21, 2013, 08:13:51 PM »
Salamun alaikum ,

Questions asked by a fellow believer :-


1)Fellow believer -
Do we have a free will whenever we choose to select a Good  or evil path or its because Allah has already decided it for us ?

Me-
Considering a series of events in a single matter , We have a free will , but after certain free wills ( In any situation ) , we have to face Consequences of our previous acts  in which we have no options.

2) Fellow believer-
Were the Satan having free will when he choose not to respect Adam ?

Me-
May be he was Granted free-will at that time or It was part of Consequences of his previous misdeeds to Not to do Sujood in front of Adam. Allah knows best

3)Fellow believer-
Suppose He had free will ( not consequences of previous bad deeds )at that moment , Were Allah Aware that he will choose only Evil path before the event Actually occurred ?
If yes , Why Allah made him ?

PLEASE HELP ME TO ANSWER QUESTION NO. 3

In Brief -
SUPPOSE WE HAVE TO CHOOSE BETWEEN 2 PATHS , EVIL PATH {A} AND GOOD PATH {B}  , AND ALLAH HAS GIVEN US FREE WILL AND WE CHOOSE EVIL PATH ,  WERE ALLAH AWARE THAT WE WILL CHOOSE PATH {A}  BEFORE THE EVENT ACTUALLY HAPPENED ?

If you are not able to Understand the question clearly , please tell me , I will re-frame the Question in a different way.


'I must strive for reformation of myself and the world'

Offline Peaceful

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Re: Do we have a 'free-will' or Allah decides whatever we do ?
« Reply #1 on: January 21, 2013, 10:21:50 PM »
Yes, of course. Allah is aware of anything at any time. Allah created Satan for the Sole purpose of testing Man. Only Humans were given free will (Adam and the Apple).
Satan is a machine used to lead the Believers astray. He is not equal to God, nor is there going to be some Cosmic battle at the End Times. I'm not aware of any Verses that say he will burn(correct me if wrong).

But again, Allah knows who is going to Heaven and Hell. So it's sorta confusing.

Offline Truth Seeker

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Re: Do we have a 'free-will' or Allah decides whatever we do ?
« Reply #2 on: January 22, 2013, 01:48:35 AM »
Salaam,

God the Almighty is not bound by time. He is outside time therefore He exists in the past, present and future. Proof of this is found many times in the Quran where God tells us what will transpire in the future regarding heaven and hell. We are even told about some conversations that will take place amongst the dwellers of these places.

Quote
3)Fellow believer-
Suppose He had free will ( not consequences of previous bad deeds )at that moment , Were Allah Aware that he will choose only Evil path before the event Actually occurred ?
If yes , Why Allah made him ?

Allah made him with a purpose and satan made his choices of his own accord. He chose the wrong path and will suffer for it. He is responsible for his actions. On the Day of Judgement, he cannot claim ignorance as his deeds will be before him. God did not make satan choose the wrong path even though he knew what his fate would be before hand. Satan is under a test too as we are.

Peaceful..if I recall there is a verse in the Quran where we are told that satan is destined for hell:

7.18
"He said: Get out of this (state), despised, driven away; whoever of them will follow you, I will certainly fill hell with you all."



Offline Adil Husain

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Re: Do we have a 'free-will' or Allah decides whatever we do ?
« Reply #3 on: January 23, 2013, 04:21:49 PM »
Dear Truth Seeker ,
I can not understand how these two conditions can co-exist at a same time

"Allah made him with a purpose and
 satan made his choices of his own
 accord."

I am also in a need of verses which hints towads presence of Allah in the past , present and future. Please quote any one.

Thanks for replying
'I must strive for reformation of myself and the world'

Offline Peaceful

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Re: Do we have a 'free-will' or Allah decides whatever we do ?
« Reply #4 on: January 24, 2013, 10:16:57 PM »
You can argue that 7.18 refers also to Satan, but the verse explicitly states "whoever of them will follow you, I will certainly fill hell with you all." Do you have any clear verses solely addressed to Satan?

I think Allah created Satan for the sole purpose of tempting man. We can't all get free rides to Heaven. It must be earned through working in the name of God.

Offline Truth Seeker

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Re: Do we have a 'free-will' or Allah decides whatever we do ?
« Reply #5 on: January 25, 2013, 02:16:44 AM »
Salaam,

Satan is of the jinn and we know that they are not all evil and in fact some are believers. That leads me to think that they, like us, have free will.

Satan refused a command from God. He challenged the Creator. The Quran tells us that God cursed Satan until the Day of Judgement, but before that time, respite has been given to him as he wants to lead mankind astray.

The verse I quoted includes Satan when it refers to 'you all'. Surely if God has cursed you, your fate is sealed. There is another more specific verse that confirms 7:18.

38:85
"[That] I will surely fill Hell with you and those of them that follow you all together."




Offline Peaceful

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Re: Do we have a 'free-will' or Allah decides whatever we do ?
« Reply #6 on: January 25, 2013, 04:29:22 AM »
Then I'm just as confused as Adil I guess!

Offline Truth Seeker

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Re: Do we have a 'free-will' or Allah decides whatever we do ?
« Reply #7 on: January 25, 2013, 06:10:33 AM »
Salaam Peaceful and Adil

Humans are also made for a purpose and we also make choices of our own accord. God created us but that does not mean that He makes us do things, otherwise we would be puppets.
He will test us though and it is up to us what path we take from there.

Because God is All Knowing and is aware of what we will do in the future, this does not mean that We do not have free will. It means that God knows what we do not.

The Quran has verses which tell us about the beginning of creation and how God always existed (past)
We are told that God watches over us and knows everything we do ( present)
We are told in detail how the World will end and the state of people on the Day of Judgement ( future)

He created time but is not bound by it as we are. We function on a linear level, He does not.

Hope this clears it up.

Offline HOPE

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Re: Do we have a 'free-will' or Allah decides whatever we do ?
« Reply #8 on: January 25, 2013, 09:44:42 PM »
Salaam all,

The circumstances one is born, the community in which one is raised and in the manifestation of some hidden laws of nature which are subtly controlled by God, we have no control.  On the other hand,  man is free to exercise his will, where he can choose between good or bad, right or wrong, and for which he will be held responsible.  Poverty is the most compulsive factor in creating and promoting crime.  There are always more or less fortunate people with relative advantages or disadvantages. Crime may be the same but God being the Most Just will consider the extenuating circumstances and will  judge accordingly.

Peace,
"Hope is like a bird that senses the dawn and carefully starts to sing while it is still dark"