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Offline chadiga

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Iblis a angel/Jinn a proper name?
« on: January 03, 2012, 08:05:32 PM »
dear brothers and sisters in Islam
Whenever I read the post about the two angles and the magic, a old question come to my mind. I hope I will not make you upset. But we are here to share and learn, and I have no one else, who listens to me, so you all  have to suffer from me ... 8)
Was Iblis now a Angel and the Ginn is not a proper Name?
below the verses where Iblis is mentioned:

And He taught Adam all the names. he laid them before the angels and said: "Share with me your name if you are truthful."
He said: ". Adam, share them with their names," as he had told them their names, He said: "Did I not tell you that I know the secrets of heaven and earth, and I also know what it reveals and conceal it.
And when we said to the angels, "prostrate yourselves before Adam." As they prostrated except Iblis. He refused and behaved arrogantly and was one of the ingrates.
And we said, "Adam, Dwell you and your wife in this garden and eat plenty of it, even as you wish. But do not approach this tree, or ye be of the unjust. "
But Satan fall from it, and caused them to depart from that in which they had been. We said, "go away. Some of you are hostile to the other. And on the earth you shall stay and provision for a time. "

And yes, we have created you, then we have formed you, completed (given knowledge). Then we said to the angels: "Prostrate before Adam." Then they threw down except Iblis, he was not one to prostrate themselves.
He said: "What made you deter you from prostrating when I commanded you" He said: "I'm better than him, You created me from fire and him You created from clay.
He said: "so go away from him. It is not for you, is to be arrogant. So go out. Certainly you are one of the disdained.
He said: "Give me respite until the day on which they are raised.
Then Satan whispered to them, to show them open, which was hidden by her nakedness. And he said: "Your Lord has forbidden you this tree only lest ye should become angels or one of the Everliving."
And he swore to them: "I belong to those truly give you good advice."
He seduced her deceptive. When they had then tasted of the tree, their nakedness appeared to them and obviously they began zusammenzuheften.Und leaves of the garden to be called their Lord to them, "Have I not forbidden you this tree and said:" The Satan is an avowed enemy? "
They said: 'Our Lord we have wronged ourselves and if you do not forgive us and have mercy, we are determined to be the losers.
He said: "Go away!" One is the other enemy. And on the earth you shall stay and have provision for a time.

15:28 - 42
And when thy Lord said to the angels: "I am going to create a human being from dried clay of black smooth mud.
If I have rightly shaped it and breathed into him of My spirit, then fall down before him, and subdue it.
It threw down all the angels.
Except Iblis, he refused to bow down to be with each other.
He said: "Iblis what is with you, that you're not with those who prostrate themselves?"
He said: "I can not possibly bow down before a Being that you are made of dry clay, creating from black mud ."
He said, "then go out from him, for you are worthy of stoning.
And the curse is on thee till the Day of Judgement. "
He said: "My Lord, respite me until the day they are raised.
And when we said to the angels, "prostrate yourselves before Adam." As they prostrated themselves except Iblis. he said: "Shall I prostrate to one whom You created from clay?

And when we said to the angels, "prostrate yourselves before Adam. "As they prostrated except Iblis, he was one of the jinn. He sins against the commandment of his Lord. Will you take for him and his progeny as protectors rather than my, but you where they are enemy - a worse replacement for the unrighteous.

And we had previously imposed an obligation Adam. But he forgot, and we found him at no determination.
And when We said to the angels: "Prostrate before Adam." As they prostrated except Iblis. He refused.
As we said, "Adam, this is you and your wife certainly an enemy. Yes you both that he does not distribute out of the garden. Otherwise you'll be unhappy.
Certainly, it is granted to you is that you're not hungry therein nor naked;
and the fact that you suffer neither thirst nor heat of the sun. "
But as one of Satan whispered to him and said: "Adam, I want you to point to the tree of immortality and a rule that does not pass?"

Did I, not as an obligation imposed on children of Adam, that ye shall not serve Satan - certainly he is to you a clear enemy.
And that you shall serve me? That is a straight path.

Say: It is a huge customer, you turn away from you.
I had no knowledge about the highest leadership group, as they disputed.
I entered so I am only a plain warner.
When thy Lord said to the angels: "I will create a human being from clay.
If I have rightly shaped it and breathed into him of My Spirit, then fall down before him, and subdue it.
Since the angel threw down all together, except Iblis, he behaved arrogantly and was among the unbelievers.
He said: "Iblis, what prevented you, bow down before thee that which I create with my hands?you feel proud or are you one example to the rank of chief?
He said: "I'm better than him. you created me from fire, whereas you created him from clay.
He said: "Then go out from him, for you are worthy of stoning.
And certainly, my curse on thee till the Day of Judgement.
He said: "My Lord, grant me respite till the Day they are raised.

and about the Jinn:
51:56 / 57
And I have not created the jinn and humans only reason that they may serve me. I want neither of them nor will I care that they feed me.

To sum up:
-God orders the angels to prostrate themselves before Adam and his knowledge
-All the angels obeyed, not only Iblis. He refuses.This seems, that Iblis was an angel or by the angels
- Angels have free will, can be desobedient.("see, you were not there when the rank of chief quarrel. The same wording is found in Sura Al Imran, to mean the angels who were arguing about who was to make of them to Mary.)
- there is only one verse (18.50) where Allah speaks from Iblis, that he was one from the Ginn
- Iblis is called "the hiding of something"=Ginn - God speaks to him by that name, as will be apparent disobedience-(he is hiding  his faith)
-Iblis was arrogant. Because of his disobedience, he must go down on earth, He and the angels who followed him.
- Ginn is a synonym for obscurity hides. Ginn called so disobedient angels.? Iblis is the first to have kept his true nature hidden. He was the leader. He was the father of the jinn, as Adam was the progenitor of the people.
-After the repudiation of the sky, he is called Satan. Shaytan in Arabic means the one who burns. Now, he is cursed.
-God then sends all the jinn and humans on the earth. each another enemy. However, they can receive guidance.
-Ginn( Iblis followers) share views and despise the people. they can assume human form and can be beautiful creatures. Therefore, they lead many astray, because humans think: Beautiful=good=Angel=good
-Ginn may be rightly guided.
-Ginn, when they are really  angels,are  immortal, unlike humans. Therefore, Satan is always talking about " the day, if they are arise. The Ginn not. They will be only juged.
- There are those who have to guide through the book of God, and others which remain in disbelief and go to hell. The angels who obey God, have never ever put her at risk.

thank you for your help in this matter. salamu aleikum

Offline Abcdef ghij

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Re: Iblis a angel/Jinn a proper name?
« Reply #1 on: July 08, 2020, 12:42:30 AM »
Salamun aleyka my brother. Sorry, I know it's too late for anyone to respond, but this doubt is saned with a short response that I saw. It's related to grammar.
Here it is:
You gave good definitions, let me add this one:
The term Iblīs (Arabic: إِبْلِيس‎) may have been derived from the Arabic verbal root bls ب-ل-س (with the broad meaning of "remain in grief") or بَلَسَ (balasa, "he despaired"). Furthermore, the name is related to talbis meaning confusion.

Offline Truth Seeker

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Re: Iblis a angel/Jinn a proper name?
« Reply #2 on: July 09, 2020, 12:53:41 AM »

There was a member before who asked if Satan was a fallen angel or a jinn and Joseph replied with the following:


As-salamu alaykum

JazakAllah Khair for your kind comments. I am only a mere humble servant of God and only He knows the true condition of everyone's hearts. We ardently seek His mercy, God willing.

Please see below my response to your question.

There is not one explicit statement in the Quran which categorically states that Iblis (Satan) was an angel. Such an understanding is only 'implied' from verses where the angels were asked to prostrate (2:34, 15:28, 20:116, 38:71, 7:11, 17:61), yet Iblis did not.

The other source of interpretation is through popular Biblical understanding. However, it may come as a surprise to many Muslims and Christians that not once does the Bible categorically state that Satan / Lucifer was an angel. This is merely an interpretation,  and yet there are passages in the Bible which can lead the ardent enquirer to conclude that he was an entity other than an angel. Furthermore, there arguably are certain characteristics of the angels that could be derived from the Biblical narratives which the Quran may not be deemed to support. A full exposé of the Biblical position would be outside the scope of this response. Suffice to say, one must be prepared to challenge popular thought through the lens of its underpinning scriptural source.

However, there are explicit statements which categorically state that Iblis was a Jinn (18:50); that he has a progeny (dhuriyyati - 18:50), that he was made of fire (7:12) which is described and elucidated elsewhere in the Quran as the constituent components of the Jinn's creative essence (15:27 and 55:15) [1]; that he would be destined for hell (7:18) which is a just requital for those condemned from mankind and the jinn (7:178) and many other verses which clearly alight the reader of interdependence between both mankind and the jinn (including Iblis).

Implicit statements of the Quran must be viewed in light of the 'explicit' statements of the Quran (3:7)

With regards the order of prostration to the angels in which Iblis was included by proxy is better understood in light of verses 34:40-41 where it is clear that God does not necessarily communicate directly with the Jinn but uses the angels as a proxy. From these verses it is clear that God knowing full well who the culprits were, nevertheless asked the angels instead.

"One Day He will gather them all together, and say to the angels, "Was it you that these men used to worship?" They will say, "Glory to Thee! our (tie) is with Thee - as Protector - not with them. Nay, but they worshipped the Jinns: most of them believed in them.""

It is quite possible that the angels are used as a proxy for communication as they are tasked with decrees (97:4) and governance (ranks 37:164-166, exalted assembly 37:8, guardians in life 13:11, in felicity 16:32, in punishment 74:31) of mankind and the Jinn. Note that hell (74:31) will be the abode of the condemned from both mankind and the Jinn (6:128, 11:119, 32:13)   

At no place in the Quran are we informed of the creative essence of the angels, whether they are light or otherwise, whether they have the capacity to refuse God's command outright with arrogance (istakbara 2:34) like Iblis (even though they may ask questions 2:30), whether they have any progeny or whether they have any gender (43:19) which is explicit for humankind (4:1) and implied for the Jinn (55:56).

Finally, The Quran clearly states in another verse that angels cannot be 'arrogant' (istakbara / takabbara). Please see verse 16:49. Yet, in another verse, the Quran also clearly states that Iblis was 'arrogant' (istakbara / takabbara). Please see 2:34. Therefore, Iblis simply could not have been angel before he became arrogant or after.

I hope that helps, God willing.


[1] The Quran describes the Jinn's creative essence as 'nare-sumun' (15:27) and 'mariji-min nar' (55:15). This is not literal fire. There is some semblance of fire but it is also 'sumun' which gives one a sense of ferocity, intensity and 'marij' which means confused, impaired, mixed and something which is unsteady.  It is a description used by the Quran to best describe to a 7th century Arab audience a substance which they may not be familiar with. Clearly this is not the same substance by which mankind was created (15:26).
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Also there is also an article which you can refer to : The Jinn

Hope this helps