Recent Posts

Pages: 1 ... 3 4 [5] 6 7 ... 10
41
Q&As with Joseph Islam - Information Only / Divorce
« Last post by Hajira4545 on May 29, 2023, 01:01:59 AM »
Can women initiate divorce according to Quran? I know men can basically initiate it without any reason or nushuz involved, and they don’t need any help from court where as women traditional have been barred from initiating divorce at all and in cases they do they have to pay back mahar and that too only in cases of abuse and also the husbands permission  is needed which makes no sense.  This all has been disturbing me a lot.
42
Who is the Prophet that God spoke of in Isaiah and Deuteronomy?

According to a few verses from the Torah and the Bible, the Prophet that God spoke of is clearly not Jesus. Please note that Jesus is the Messiah, but in these specific verses, God meant a Prophet other than Jesus.

1.0   The Prophet will sing a new song of praise to God from the eastern border of Egypt, which is Saudi Arabia, while Jesus came from Nazareth, which is north of Egypt:

Ishmael is the son of Abraham and Kedar is the son of Ishmael. Kedar lived near the eastern border of Egypt, which is Saudi Arabia, where Prophet Mohamed lived. The Servant whom God will send will sing a new song of praise to God, and the settlements in which Kedar lives will rejoice. The settlements in which Kedar lives are Saudi Arabia believing in the Quran. This means that the new song that God spoke of is the Quran. But Jesus came from Nazareth which is north of Egypt. Isaiah also says, “Let the wilderness and its towns raise their voices”, and the meaning of the wilderness is an uncultivated land, that is a desert. Mohamed came from Saudi Arabia, which is a desert, while Jesus came from Nazareth which is a cultivated land full of gardens. The reason they will raise their voices is to glorify God with “Allah Akbar” which means “God is great.”

•   Genesis (25:13) These are the names of the sons of Ishmael…then Kedar…

•   Genesis (25:18) His descendants settled in the area from Havilah to Shur, near the eastern border of Egypt…

•   Isaiah (42:10-12) Sing to the Lord a new song, his praise from the ends of the earth… Let the wilderness and its towns raise their voices; let the settlements where Kedar lives rejoice… Let them give glory to the Lord…

2.0   Mohamed’s name is mentioned in the Torah in Hebrew, but has been translated as “lovely” in other languages:

The Hebrew word for God is אֱלֹהִים which is pronounced Eloh-im. Eloh-im is a plural of God i.e. Gods. But in Hebrew, when the suffix “im” is added to a word, it is added to indicate the majestic plural of the preceding entity, not the plural of numbers, because the Torah says that there is one God only.

•   Deuteronomy (6-4) Hear, O Israel: The Lord is our God; the Lord is one.

•   Hebrew – Genesis (1:1) א בְּרֵאשִׁית, בָּרָא אֱלֹהִים, אֵת הַשָּׁמַיִם, וְאֵת הָאָרֶץ

•   English – Genesis (1:1) In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.

“-im” is also mentioned in the preceding entity in the Song of Solomon as מַחֲמַדִּים and they translated to “lovely” which is incorrect. It should be translated to “Mohammedd-im”. As I explained above, the suffix “im” is to indicate the honor plural of the preceding entity. The Bible hub website, a Christian website, used the correct translation “ma-ha-mad-dim” in the fourth row of https://biblehub.com/text/songs/5-16.htm Therefore, Prophet Mohamed is mentioned in the Old Testament as the beloved friend of Prophet Solomon, but his name was omitted when translated into other languages and replaced with the word “lovely”.

•   Hebrew – Song of Solomon (5:16) חִכּוֹ, מַמְתַקִּים, וְכֻלּוֹ, מַחֲמַדִּים; זֶה דוֹדִי וְזֶה רֵעִי, בְּנוֹת יְרוּשָׁלִָם     

•   English – Song of Solomon (5:16) His mouth is most sweet; yea, he is altogether lovely. This is my beloved, and this is my friend, O daughters of Jerusalem.

3.0   The Prophet will have a grave:

•   Isaiah (53:9) He was assigned a grave with the wicked, and with the rich in his death, though he had done no violence, nor was any deceit in his mouth.

The verse says that he was assigned a grave. Christians believe that Jesus was buried for three days and then resurrected. Therefore, he had a grave for three days. However, as I explained above, Jesus was not crucified nor died, and that the heart of the earth that he entered was not a grave but a cave, therefore Jesus did not have a grave. If Christians disagree with this, then they must realize that when God told us that he was assigned a grave, He meant that the grave will exist at all times until the Day of Judgment so that it will be a proof for whoever wants to see it. However, Prophet Mohamed has a grave even today. 

Christians claim that the verse says he had done no violence, and that Mohamed had engaged in many battles. But Mohamed did not initiate any violence and he was fighting only in self-defense. Christians claim that it didn’t matter whether he engaged in violence in self-defense or not, the bottom line is that he was engaged in violence. Well, the Bible says that Jesus told people to sell their clothes and buy swords. Swords are used in battles to kill people. In this situation, Jesus was also engaged in violence. But, please note that the law of God allows humans to fight for self-defense, that is, when Jesus and Mohamed fought in any battle in self-defense, it is not considered violence.

•   Luke (22:36) Then He said to them, “But now, he who has a money bag, let him take it, and likewise a knapsack; and he who has no sword, let him sell his garment and buy one.

4.0   The Prophet will see his offspring:
 
•   Isaiah (53:10) Yet it was the Lord’s will to crush him and cause him to suffer, and though the Lord makes his life an offering for sin, he will see his offspring and prolong his days, and the will of the Lord will prosper in his hand.

The verse says that the will of God is to crush him and cause him to suffer, but does not say that the will of God is to kill him. This means that the will of God is to let him work with difficulty and fight in many battles to defend the oppressed ones who can’t defend themselves and to cause him wounds and suffering. Then the verse says that he will see his offspring, but Jesus had no children while Muhammad had. Christians believe that whoever believes in Jesus is his spiritual offspring, and they use the following verse to prove it.

•   Revelation (21:5) He who was seated on the throne said, “I am making everything new!” Then he said, “Write this down, for these words are trustworthy and true.” 6 He said to me: “It is done. I am the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End. To the thirsty I will give water without cost from the spring of the water of life. 7 Those who are victorious will inherit all this, and I will be their God and they will be my children.

The verses say, “He who was seated on the throne said” which is God who was seated on the throne said: I will be their God and they will be my children. The verse says that the victorious will be the children of God, not the children of Jesus. Evidence is found in Galatians that Jesus is not God because it says that we are the children of God through faith in Jesus, and it does not say that we are the children of Jesus. If Jesus was God, the verse would have said that we are the children of Jesus. The meaning of “through faith in Jesus” is by following his teachings. I have provided evidence from the Bible in the next pages, section “Is Jesus God or son of God” that Jesus is not God.

•   Galatians (3:26) For you are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus

The verse says that he will see his offspring and prolong his days, and there is a reason for God to prolong his life, which is to show him his offspring in his eyes. This is evidence that the Christians’ assumption that the meaning of “offspring” is “spiritual offspring” is incorrect. This proves that God intended a prophet other than Jesus, because
Jesus had no children.

5.0   God told Moses that He will send a Prophet:

•   Deuteronomy (18:18) I will raise up for them a prophet like you from among their brothers…

God said that the prophet will be like Moses, but Jesus is different than Moses because Jesus was born without a father, only from a mother “Mary”, while Moses was born from a father and a mother. This is evidence that God meant a prophet other than Jesus. Christians believe that the meaning of “like you” is that he will be a preacher like Moses. But at the beginning of the verse, God said that he is a prophet, and the duty of a prophet is to preach God’s truth to people.

God told Moses that the Prophet will be one of their brothers, and the Christians thought that he will be one of the brothers of the Israelites, the house of Jacob, because of these verses:

1.   Deuteronomy (18:15) The Lord your God will raise up for you a prophet like me from among you, from your brothers - it is to him you shall listen

Please note that God first said “from among you” which means from the family of Prophet Abraham. Muslims,
Christians and Jews are all from the family of Prophet Abraham because he is our father. Then God clarified it and said “from your brothers” which means that the prophet will be from one of the brothers of the sons of Abraham. Isaac and Ishmael are the sons of Abraham. Jesus is a descendant of Isaac and Mohamed is a descendant of Ishmael. This means that the prophet will come from the decedents of Ishmael and not from Isaac because Ishmael is the brother of Isaac.

2.   Deuteronomy (17:15) you may indeed set a king over you whom the LORD your God will choose. One from among your brothers you shall set as king over you. You may not put a foreigner over you, who is not your brother

Then Christians also thought that he will be from the Israelites because God said that you may not put a “foreigner” over you. As I explained above, Ishmael is one of the sons of Abraham, and the brother of Isaac, and not a foreigner.

•   Genesis (25:9) Isaac and Ishmael, his [Abraham] sons, buried him in the cave of Machpelah…

The proof that the prophet will come from Ishmael’s decedents and not from Isaac is in Genesis (17:20) which says that the offspring of Ishmael will be a great nation e.g. winners of paradise.

•   Genesis (17:20) “And as for Ishmael, I have heard thee: Behold, I have blessed him, and will make him fruitful, and will multiply him exceedingly; twelve princes shall he beget, and I will make him a great nation.”

Please note that the meaning of “great” is not in quantity because God said that He will multiply him exceedingly, but He made it clear that He will make it a great nation to refer to it by quality as in Merriam-Webster dictionary. Great Definition & Meaning - Merriam-Webster 
i.   In No. 6, great means: markedly superior in character or quality, especially: noble, great of soul
ii.   As an Adverb, it means: in a great manner: well
iii.   As a Noun, it means: an outstandingly superior or skillful person

But in the next verse, God said that He will establish His covenant with Isaac.

•   Genesis (17:21) “But my covenant will I establish with Isaac, which Sarah shall bear unto thee at this set time in the next year.”

Although God established His covenant with Isaac, but his descendants violated it and that is why Jesus told them
that the kingdom of God will be taken away from them and will be given to another nation.

•   Matthew (21:43) Therefore I say to you, the kingdom of God will be taken from you and given to a nation bearing the fruits of it.

The nation Jesus refers to is not the Christians because the ancestors of the Christians in Jesus’ time are of the same origins as the Israelites, and both are descendants of Isaac. Also, as in Genesis (17:20) above, God said that He will make the descendants of Ishmael fruitful, that is, nobles and people of good character, and Jesus said that the nation whose God will give them His kingdom will bear the fruits of it. This means that they will fulfill the covenant with God. This is evidence that Jesus meant Mohamed because he is from the descendants of Ishmael.

God said He will send a prophet to the nations. Nations is plural which means many nations. But Jesus came to one nation only that is “Israel”, which is single nation. This proves that God meant a prophet other than Jesus.

•   Isaiah (42:6) I am the LORD; I have called you in righteousness; I will take you by the hand and keep you;       
I will give you as a covenant for the people, a light for the nations.

•   Matthew (15:24) Then Jesus said to the woman, “I was sent only to help God’s lost sheep - the people of Israel”

On the other hand, God said in the Quran that He sent Prophet Mohamed to all nations.

•   Quran (7:158) Say, [O Muhammad], “O mankind, indeed I am the Messenger of Allah to you all, [from Him] to whom belongs the dominion of the heavens and the earth. There is no deity except Him; He gives life and causes death.” So believe in Allah and His Messenger, the unlettered prophet, who believes in
Allah and His words, and follow him that you may be guided.

The proof that this man is Mohamed is in Deuteronomy (18:20) which says that if any liar claims to be a prophet,
God will kill him. However, God did not kill Mohamed. He survived for 22 years until he delivered the Quran to mankind. Also keep in mind that Mohamed fought many battles, but God protected him at all times.

•   Deuteronomy (18:20) But the prophet who presumes to speak a word in My name, which I have not commanded him to speak, or who speaks in the name of other gods, that prophet shall die.’

6.0   The Counselor:

Jesus said in the Bible that he will ask God to send a Counselor/Advocate after he leaves. Christians believe that the Counselor is the Holy Spirit.

•   John (16:7) Nevertheless, I am telling you the truth. It is for your benefit that I go away, because if I don’t go away the Counselor will not come to you. If I go, I will send him to you.

But the Holy Spirit descended while Jesus was still on earth, this means that Jesus did not mean the Holy Spirit, but rather someone other than the Holy Spirit because it was with us before his departure.

•   Matthew (3:16) As soon as Jesus was baptized, he went up out of the water. At that moment heaven was opened, and he saw the Spirit of God descending like a dove and alighting on him.

And the Holy Spirit was also there in the hearts of the believers since Moses and David. Christians believe that the Holy Spirit was temporarily with David and Moses, but this is not true because the Spirit of God guides or leads believers to God’s truth. This means that the Spirit of God has existed since the time of Adam, the father of humanity, and there is no reason for Jesus to ask God to send it back because it was already there before his was gone. This is another proof that Jesus meant someone other than the Holy Spirit.

•   Numbers (27:18) And the LORD said to Moses: “Take Joshua the son of Nun with you, a man in whom is the Spirit, and lay your hand on him;
•   Samuel (16:13) Then Samuel took the horn of oil and anointed him in the midst of his brothers; and the Spirit of the Lord came upon David from that day forward. So Samuel arose and went to Ramah.

The Bible says that the Counselor will tell us about the future. Well, the Quran has told many parables about the future that some of which have been discovered in our days with advanced technology. This technology was not available at the time of Prophet Mohamed.

•   John (16:13) When the Spirit of truth comes, he will guide you into all truth. He will not speak on his own but will tell you what he has heard. He will tell you about the future.

1.   To name a few, God said in the Quran that there are seven layers of heaven and seven layers of earth. Today, scientists have discovered that there are seven layers of the Earth. Seven layers of earth - Search (bing.com)

•   Quran (65:12) It is Allah who has created seven heavens and of the earth, the like of them…

•   Quran (71:15) Do you not see how Allah created seven heavens, one above the other,

Since God said that the seven earths are like the seven heavens and in another verse He said that the heavens are in layers, one on top of the other, therefore, the seven earths are also in layers, one on top of the other.

2.   God said in the Quran that the bee has more than one belly. Science has proven that today.
Honeybees Have Two Stomachs - Bee Mission

•   Quran (16:68) And your Lord inspired to the bee… (69) …There emerges from their bellies a drink…

3.   God said in the Quran that He created the fruits in pairs of male and female. Science has proven today that the flowers of the fruits are male and female. fruits are male and female - Search (bing.com)

•   Quran (13:3) it was He who spread out the earth and placed upon it mountains and rivers, and fruits of every kind in male and female pairs…

4.   God said that whoever does not want to guide to Islam because they don’t want guidance, He chokes their chest as if they are ascending to the sky. Today Science has proven that there is no air after about 100 km above the Earth. there is no air in the space - Search (bing.com)

•   Quran (6:125) And whomsoever it is Allah’s will to guide, He expandeth his bosom unto the Surrender, and whomsoever it is His Will to send astray, He maketh his bosom close and narrow as if he were engaged in sheer ascent. Thus Allah layeth ignominy upon those who believe not

The question is how did Mohamed know these miracles? Non-Muslims claim that Satan passed these secrets to Mohamed so that people would believe that he is a prophet. But how did Satan know the secrets that were mentioned in the Quran if the Bible says that no one has the ability to predict and reveal future events or know what tomorrow holds except God alone. This proves that it was God who passed these secrets to Mohamed.

•   Revelation (5:2-3) And I saw a mighty angel proclaiming in a loud voice, “Who is worthy to break the seals and open the scroll?” But no one in heaven or on earth or under the earth could open the scroll or even look inside it.

•   Matthew (24:36) But concerning that day and hour no one knows, not even the angels of heaven, nor the Son, but the Father only.

The Bible says that the Counselor will testify about Jesus.

•   John (15:26) But when the Helper comes, whom I shall send to you from the Father, the Spirit of truth who proceeds from the Father, He will testify of Me.
Well, the Quran testified about Jesus that he is distinguished in this world and the hereafter and among those brought near to God, and also testified about his mother Mary that she is the most purified woman on earth.

•   Quran (3:45) [And mention] when the angels said, “O Mary, indeed Allah gives you good tidings of a word
from Him, whose name will be the Messiah, Jesus, the son of Mary - distinguished in this world and the Hereafter and among those brought near [to Allah].

•   Quran (3:42) And [mention] when the angels said, O Mary, indeed God has chosen you and purified you and chosen you above the women of the worlds.

The Bible says that the Counselor will be with us forever. The Quran that God sent to Mohamed is still with us even today. Please watch non-Muslims on CNN News who tested the original version of the Quran written in the presence of Prophet Mohamed over 1,400 years ago and compared it to the current version of the Quran we have today and found it to be the same. Ancient Quran manuscript discovered | CNN

The verse also says that the world does not accept him. Well, the majority of people on earth do not accept Mohamed, insult him, call him a terrorist, draw him in dirty cartoons to mock him, and so on, while the majority of people does not insult or mock Jesus even if they didn’t believe in him.

•   John (14:16) And I will ask the Father, and he will give you another advocate to help you and be with you forever 17 the Spirit of truth. The world cannot accept him, because it neither sees him nor knows him. But you know him, for he lives with you and will be in you.

This proves that Prophet Mohamed is the Counselor that the Bible spoke of.
43
Women / Divorce
« Last post by Hajira4545 on May 27, 2023, 10:10:41 PM »
Can women initiate divorce according to Quran? I know men can basically initiate it without any reason or nushuz involved, and they don’t need any help from court where as women traditional have been barred from initiating divorce at all and in cases they do they have to pay back mahar and that too only in cases of abuse and also the husbands permission  is needed which makes no sense.  This all has been disturbing me a lot.
44
Women / Re: Dress code based on verses 24:31 and 33:59
« Last post by atijd on May 21, 2023, 05:49:09 PM »
Salam Wakas. Thank you for your response. I would also like Br. Joseph to give his perspective.

Quick question: do you think that this costume would be in line with verses 24:31 and 33:59? The cloak over her could be a jilbab, or outer garment that covers her normal clothes. I'd also want Br. Joseph to opine.

45
Women / Re: Dress code based on verses 24:31 and 33:59
« Last post by Wakas on May 21, 2023, 03:56:04 PM »
peace,

Those verses are covered here:
https://misconceptions-about-islam.com/misconception.php?id=34

Misconception: Muslim women must fully cover up in Islam
Background: Some think that Muslim women must cover their whole body, including face when in public. Women's dress code in Islam is one of the most focused upon subjects not only in the Western media but also in Muslim countries, yet it remains one of the most distorted and misunderstood.

Firstly, according to The Quran, the most important rule of the dress code for both men and women is as follows:

O children of Adam, we have provided you with garments to cover your bodies, as well as to adorn you. But the best garment is the garment of piety/righteousness. These are some of God's signs, so that they may be mindful. [7:26]

The garment of righteousness/piety could either refer to choosing a garment that reflects this quality or enveloping oneself in righteous/pious conduct is best, or both.

The following verses tells women to guard their private parts (i.e. genitalia) and cover their chests:

Tell the believing men to lower their gaze and guard their private parts, for that is purer for them. God is fully aware of what you do.
And tell the believing women to lower their gaze and guard their private parts, and that they should not reveal their beauty except what is apparent of it, and let them draw with their covers over their chests. And let them not reveal their beauty except to their husbands, or their fathers, or fathers of their husbands, or their sons, or the sons of their husbands, or their brothers, or the sons of their brothers, or the sons of their sisters, or their women, or those committed to them by oath, or the male servants who are without need, or the child who has not yet understood the composition of women. And let them not strike with their feet that reveals what they are keeping hidden of their beauty. And repent to God, all of you believers, that you may succeed. [24:30-31]

From the above verse it can be deduced that for the purposes of women's dress code two types of beauty are described:

1) What is apparent (this can be revealed in public)
2) What is hidden (this type must be covered in public, but could be revealed by a striking of feet or walk/stride which is revealing)

Such a striking of feet or walk could only reveal a limited number of parts of the body, e.g. the private parts, buttocks, thighs, breasts, hips, thus any part not revealed by such an action should not be considered part of hidden beauty and therefore part of apparent beauty. Of course, this means such things as face, hair, hands, feet etc would not clearly fall into the category of beauty that is meant to be hidden. Furthermore, the verse clearly brackets what beauty it is referring to by saying "...the child who has not yet understood the composition of women" implying it is relating to what is specific to a woman (i.e. what is different between man and woman) nothing else.
This understanding would also fit with The Quran's instruction on the body parts that are to be cleansed during daily ablution (hands, arms, face, head and feet), see 5:6, 4:43.

A headscarf (commonly called "hijab") is often worn by Muslim women, however this word is not used like this in The Quran. In fact, the word "hijab" is not even used to mean an item of clothing and simply means something which intervenes between two things, e.g. barrier, screen, seclusion. All verses where this word occurs are as follows: 7:46, 33:53, 38:32, 41:5, 42:51, 17:45, 19:17, 83:15. It should also be noted that believing men and women are free to eat in each other's company, whether family or friends [24:61], thus a veil covering the face (commonly called "niqab", or the full veil "burqa") would obviously be impractical. Again, such an item of clothing is nowhere to be found in The Quran.

Another common mistake regarding dress code is when the following situation-specific verse is applied to all situations:

And those who harm the believing men and the believing women, with no just reason, they have brought upon themselves a slander and a gross sin.
O prophet, tell your wives, your daughters, and the woman of the believers that they shall lengthen (or draw near) over themselves their outer-garments. That is more likely they be recognized so not harmed. God is Forgiver, Merciful.
If the hypocrites and those with disease in their hearts and those who spread lies in the city do not refrain*, then We will let you overpower them, then they will not be able to remain as your neighbours except for a short while. [33:58-60]
*proving harm is already occurring, and refers back to 33:58, which is before the modification in dress is mentioned.

The mistake is exposed when the practicalities of applying the above verses are considered. The verses deal with open enmity with significant repercussions for the perpetrators if this behaviour does not stop. The open enmity is direct to the person, hence the need for the women to modify their outer-garment in order to be recognised in public and not harmed. For the suggested solution in these verses to succeed four things must be in place:

1) The open enmity or harm must be present in the community first and direct to the women
2) The modification in outer-garment and the consequence for the perpetrator of not abiding by this identification code must either be made known to the community or this would have to be common knowledge amongst the community
3) The modification recommended would be enough to differentiate one group from another
4) The authority is in place to fight/expel those persisting in this behaviour

Clearly, this specific criteria has to be fulfilled for these verses to work, thus is not a universal rule. It is situation-specific, e.g. if a section of the community become hostile to believing women or women in general and the believers have some power in the land, then they can utilise this solution, effectively giving an ultimatum with no room for excuse for the perpetrators.

These verses are commonly interpreted to mean that Muslim women must lengthen (or draw near) their outer-garment whenever in public even in times of peace. However, this is easily refuted by considering that if this was the case and open enmity then appeared, the modification suggested in these verses would already exist, thus implementing the modification in these verses could not be done, thus rendering the solution described in these verses as void.
However, from these verses it can be deduced that wearing of an outer-garment by women when in public was the norm.

The following verse shows being clothed is the norm but makes it clear that flexibility is allowed in certain situations, as long as we are mindful of modesty. The context is etiquette within the household:

And the women who are past child bearing and who do not seek to get married have no sin upon them if they discard their garments*, provided they do not show off with their beauty. If they abstain, then it is better for them. God is Hearer, Knower. [24:60]
*Arabic word is "thiyab" and refers to ordinary clothes/gowns.

It should be noted that all examples of dress in The Quran of the righteous or believing men and women involve wearing garments, e.g. 18:31, 22:23, 24:58, 24:60, 35:33, 74:4, 76:21. Also, to provide clothing for others is considered a charitable or righteous act [4:5, 2:233, 5:89].

As can be seen, The Quran gives us a set of simple basic rules with flexible guidance for the rest, which can be applied to different situations/society/function. This flexibility is a mercy but has unfortunately been abused by various schools of thought and religious leaders who have issued their own additional rulings and consequently there is disagreement amongst them on other than the basic rules.

Additional notes for Arabic readers:
The word "khumur" is used in 24:31 and can be the plural of "khimaar" or "khimirr", and can mean any cover made of cloth or headcover, according to Classical Arabic dictionaries and Traditional Ahadith/Narrations (see Bukhari Volume 6, Book 60, Number 282). Please note the Arabic preposition "bi" meaning "with" in "bikhumurihinna", which means they are to cover their chests with their "khumur/covers/headcovers". The usage of preposition "bi" is different to the preposition "min" as used in 33:59 "min jalabeebihinna" which means to use a part of their "jilbab/outer-garment" in the modification suggested, i.e. not all of it has to be lowered or drawn near, just part of it. In 24:31 if God intended that part of it (e.g. headcover) stays on the head and part of it be used to cover the bosom, it would have been more appropriate to use "min khumurhinna". Furthermore, the word "yadribna" as used in 24:31 has no connotation of lengthening or lowering in any other occurrence, unlike "yudneena" in 33:59 which does, thus would have been more appropriate to use.
Even if "khumur" is taken to mean "headcovers" it should be noted that the order is to cover the chest, not the head - of course, one may cover their head if they wish.




46
Islamic Duties / Meaning of Salat
« Last post by Cihan on May 18, 2023, 12:05:26 PM »
Selam brothers and sisters

Though I have a lot of points to make on this, I believe it would be best if instead of me listing them all, that we go one by one, try to agree on and settle one point and then move onto the next.

I am fully aware that traditionally "Salat" is understood as "prayer", more precisely "5 times a day, ritual prayer". Salat is also translated in the Quran as things like, blessing, honour and in 22.40 strangely as Synagogues.

The root meaning of "Salat" is to follow something closely.  (In a horse race when the second horse follows the first one so closely that its head always overlaps the first horse’s body that horse is called AL-MUSSALLI (i.e. the one who follows closely / remains attached).

My point would be referring to Surah 11 Verse 87 which is translated as [They said, "O Shuaib! Does your prayer (Salat) command you that we leave what worship our forefathers, or that we do concerning our wealth what we will? Indeed you, surely you (are) the forbearing, the right-minded."]

Some translators due to this nonsensical translation are forced to insert, in brackets, things such as

"(thy habit) of prayer" - Asad
"thy way of prayer" - Pickthall
"thy (religion of) prayer" - Yusuf Ali

to salvage the situation which fails.

As Im sure you will all agree, a prayer cannot command. A prayer is calling out to God and in this instance the person in question is Prophet Shu'ayb. How can prayer, coming from Prophet Shu'aybs own mouth, directed at God, command Prophet Shu'ayb himself?!?

This is the first point I would like discussed before we move on. This translation is a logical fallacy and the Quran being the Word of God, is free from such things. This Verse alone, is sufficent for me to reject "Salat" as prayer, much less  "5 times a day ritual prayer"

Once we insert the correct meaning of the word into the verse, the result is this;

They said, "O Shuaib! Does, WHAT YOU FOLLOW (Salat), command you that we leave what worship our forefathers, or that we do concerning our wealth what we will? Indeed you, surely you (are) the forbearing, the right-minded."]

Which makes perfect sense.

Looking forward to reading your view and opinions.

Your brother in Faith
Cihan
47
General Discussions / Meaning of Salat
« Last post by Cihan on May 18, 2023, 11:28:01 AM »
Selam brothers and sisters

Though I have a lot of points to make on this, I believe it would be best if instead of me listing them all, that we go one by one, try to agree on and settle one point and then move onto the next.

I am fully aware that traditionally "Salat" is understood as "prayer", more precisely "5 times a day, ritual prayer". Salat is also translated in the Quran as things like, blessing, honour and in 22.40 strangely as Synagogues.

The root meaning of "Salat" is to follow something closely.  (In a horse race when the second horse follows the first one so closely that its head always overlaps the first horse’s body that horse is called AL-MUSSALLI (i.e. the one who follows closely / remains attached).

My point would be referring to Surah 11 Verse 87 which is translated as [They said, "O Shuaib! Does your prayer (Salat) command you that we leave what worship our forefathers, or that we do concerning our wealth what we will? Indeed you, surely you (are) the forbearing, the right-minded."]

Some translators due to this nonsensical translation are forced to insert, in brackets, things such as

"(thy habit) of prayer" - Asad
"thy way of prayer" - Pickthall
"thy (religion of) prayer" - Yusuf Ali

to salvage the situation which fails.

As Im sure you will all agree, a prayer cannot command. A prayer is calling out to God and in this instance the person in question is Prophet Shu'ayb. How can prayer, coming from Prophet Shu'aybs own mouth, directed at God, command Prophet Shu'ayb himself?!?

This is the first point I would like discussed before we move on. This translation is a logical fallacy and the Quran being the Word of God, is free from such things. This Verse alone, is sufficent for me to reject "Salat" as prayer, much less  "5 times a day ritual prayer"

Once we insert the correct meaning of the word into the verse, the result is this;

They said, "O Shuaib! Does, WHAT YOU FOLLOW (Salat), command you that we leave what worship our forefathers, or that we do concerning our wealth what we will? Indeed you, surely you (are) the forbearing, the right-minded."]

Which makes perfect sense.

Looking forward to reading your view and opinions.

Your brother in Faith
Cihan


48
Women / Re: Dress code based on verses 24:31 and 33:59
« Last post by atijd on May 18, 2023, 09:05:20 AM »
For instance, is a jilbab required? Is it a cloak?
49
Women / Dress code based on verses 24:31 and 33:59
« Last post by atijd on May 18, 2023, 08:38:29 AM »
Salam everyone,

I was wondering if someone, primarily Br. Joseph could explain the dress code required of a woman based on verses 24:31 and 33:59. I read his articles but I want it to be broken down into specifics.
50
General Discussions / Verse continuing in the other
« Last post by Pouyah on May 12, 2023, 04:42:17 AM »
Peace Brothers and sisters

Upon reading the passage in sura 2.219-220 i realized that the words "regarding this life and the hereafter" in 220 are a part of the previous verse, 219. Have you came across other passagea like this and what is the function do you think?
Pages: 1 ... 3 4 [5] 6 7 ... 10