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Offline Deliverance

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Re: The meaning of "ZaKAt"
« Reply #15 on: June 26, 2014, 10:13:34 PM »
Anwar,

I agree it is only one vers i think where "zakat" is used with "mal"/Money but rest is mentioned together with salat.

Food can also be zakah
Sura 18:19
Such (being their state), We raised them up (from sleep), that they might question each other. Said one of them "How long have ye stayed (here)?" They said "We have stayed (perhaps) a day or part of a day." (At length) they (all) said "Allah (alone) knows best how long ye have stayed here...Now send ye then one of you with this money of yours to the town: let him find out which is the best food (to be had) and bring some to you, that (ye may satisfy hunger therewith:) and let him behave with care and courtesy, and let him not inform anyone about you. (19)

But is "zakah" food the same meaning with "halal" and "tayeb" food?
Sura 5:88
"Eat of that which Allah hath bestowed on you as food lawful and good, and keep your duty to Allah in Whom ye are believers. (88)"

Offline Deliverance

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Re: The meaning of "ZaKAt"
« Reply #16 on: June 27, 2014, 09:17:46 AM »
I want to add that proper behaviour is making you get "zakat"

Sura 24
"If ye find no one in the house enter not until permission is given to you: if ye are asked to go back, go back: that makes for greater purity for yourselves: and Allah knows well all that ye do. (28) It is no fault on your part to enter houses not used for living in, which serve some (other) use for you: and Allah has knowledge of what ye reveal and what ye conceal. (29) Say to the believing men that they should lower their gaze and guard their modesty: that will make for greater purity for them: and Allah is well acquainted with all that they do. (30)"

The easiest form is to give some of your income to People,that is what the average muslims do and understand in giving "zakat"once a year and in "ramadhan" to give zakat al-fitr to have their fasting excepted.But the real zakat is not to follow the footsteps of the evil and put a burden on you Soul.Thus by doing zakat you pure your Soul and you can enter the Garden in the hereafter.
Sura 20
" Verily he who comes to his Lord as a sinner (at judgment)― for him is Hell: therein shall he neither die nor live. (74) But such as comes to Him as Believers who have worked righteous deeds--for them are ranks exalted― (75) Gardens of Eternity, beneath which flow rivers: they will dwell therein for aye: such is the reward of those who purify themselves (from evil). (76)"

Regards

Offline Saba

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Re: The meaning of "ZaKAt"
« Reply #17 on: June 27, 2014, 12:40:17 PM »
The only way to ascertain the meanings of the words used in the Quran is through Classical Arabic dictionaries. To say that one cannot obtain meanings from the these dictionaries for words use in the Quran defies logic.
Salam

I really respect this statement!!!! thank you for saying this.

On page 1241 of the lanes lexicon who seems to quote other old Arabic authorities says:

>>>this is the only instance in the Kur-An in which it is used in any other sense than that which next follows. ...And [The poor-rate;] the portion,or amount, of property, that is given therefrom, (M, IAth, Mgh, Mvb, ], Er-Rsghib, TA,) as the due of God, (Er-R&ghib, TA,) by its possessor, (M, V, TA,) to the poor, (M, Mgh, Er-Rbghib, TA,) in order that he may purify it thereby: (M, IAth, g, TA:) [in the g it is merely said that " the 'zakah'j of property is well known :" the giving it is obligatory, provided that the property is of a certain amount>>>

I got this from a link here ....http://www.studyquran.co.uk/PRLonline.htm

Now this is from a classical lexicon and fits in the Qur'an. The dictionaries speak of it as being an increase on wealth or property so this is also not a problem definition.

Just because a rate is not given by the Qur'an doesn't mean the definition of zakat is wrong. It may be that Allah (swt) doesn't want one rate to fit all circumstances and has left it to people who are in power or government to decide an appropriate rate. This is what the article also spoke about.

So my q is why should this definition be denied when it is in the classical lexicons and fits the Qur'an. Why deny this and pick another simply because we don't like this definition???? Why?? Saba




Offline Deliverance

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Re: The meaning of "ZaKAt"
« Reply #18 on: June 27, 2014, 02:50:41 PM »
Noone is saying that the Definition of "zakah" is wrong,i only say focusing on paying a certain amount of wealth and labeling it with "zakah" is not the proper meaning of zakah.

Quote from Saba:
"Just because a rate is not given by the Qur'an doesn't mean the definition of zakat is wrong. It may be that Allah (swt) doesn't want one rate to fit all circumstances and has left it to people who are in power or government to decide an appropriate rate. This is what the article also spoke about."

In my humble opinion is not left for People in power to decide what is to pay for zakah because in the the Quran it is said that Allah is making someone "zakah" or not.You have to do it for seeking the pleasure of God and not by force.

In Aramaic zakuh is a verb and means ,to be pure;good;innocently;

Offline Saba

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Re: The meaning of "ZaKAt"
« Reply #19 on: June 27, 2014, 04:21:43 PM »

My comment was not directed at you (Deliverance) and I have already mentioned that I do not want to talk to you about this topic. So please can you stop talking to me directly about this.

As far as your comment is concerned:

In my humble opinion is not left for People in power to decide what is to pay for zakah because in the the Quran it is said that Allah is making someone "zakah" or not.You have to do it for seeking the pleasure of God and not by force.

Read 22:41

"(They are) those who, if We establish them in the land, establish regular prayer and give regular charity, enjoin the right and forbid wrong: with Allah rests the end (and decision) of (all) affairs. "

Like I said, please don't talk to me directly about your views or opinions on my comments. I'm sure its against one of the QM's forum policy if someone has requested not to continue dialogue.... I am happy to hear from anyone else about my comments however. Thanx, Saba

Offline Deliverance

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Re: The meaning of "ZaKAt"
« Reply #20 on: June 27, 2014, 06:53:17 PM »
Alright Saba i leave you alone.

salam aleikoum


Offline Anwar

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Re: The meaning of "ZaKAt"
« Reply #21 on: June 27, 2014, 07:12:28 PM »
Deliverance.

The word used in 18:19 is azkaa. It is the superlative of zakeey or zakeeyah, which means good or pure. It means more pure or most pure. Like Akbar is the superlative of kabeer, meaning most kabeer or more kabeer (kabeer has so many meanings I am deciding not to translate all them in order to be fair to the word). Zakaah is not used in 18:19.

Saba,

I have a lot of issues with Lane's lexicon, but I won't go there because for general purposes and when better is not available it is fine. I generally refer to Lisanul-Arab and other completely Arabic lexicons which are older and more comprehensive than Lane's lexicon can ever be. Why he didn't just translate Taj Al-'Arous or Lisanul-Arab is beyond me.

What you are not realizing here is that Zakaah as charity clearly has its origin in post-Quranic Islamic opinion. This is where Lane fails and where earlier and more authoritative Classical Arabic lexicons succeed, as they are interested in Classical Arabic as a whole, and in detailing what is post-Quranic and Islamic and what is not, many times even referring to the pre-islamic poetries to show meanings that some meanings were clearly used in pre-Islamic times but generally fell out of use after the Quran. Take Mu'jam Al-faadh Al-Quran's comment that raaki3 also had a meaning of monotheist and one who did not worship idols among the pre-islamic Arabs. Lane's sources on many words are clearly Islamic and not linguistic in nature.

This means that anything clearly Islamic in origin, i.e., post-Quranic cannot be read into the Quran because the Quran's language is naturally pre-Islamic and pre-Quranic in origin as it borrowed the language of the pre-Islamic and pre-Quranic Arabs. Again, this means that ANY meaning of a word with an Islamic and post-Quranic origin cannot be read into the Qur'an.

Lisanul-Arab first has Zakaah as righteousness/correctness (Al-Salaa7) and has Az-zakaah as zakaatul-maal, i.e. zakaah as zakaah of the wealth (this is already logically problematic). He goes on to say that this is known and that it is purification (tat-heer) of one's wealth. He adds that it is "what you take out from your wealth in order to purify it." I don't know if you see the logical flaws here but the first is in explaining al-zakaah using the same word again, and stating that it is zakaah of one's wealth, which is then explained as purifying one's wealth. This already intimates that Zakaah as purity is the stronger and more original meaning. 

It also begs questions such as did the pre-Islamic Arabs have a concept of purifying wealth or setting aside some of one's wealth in order to purify it? And is this even a Quranically valid concept? Does the wealth we earn morally and within Quranic guidelines need to be purified?

What is mentioned next is a partial phrase from 9:103.

خذ من أموالهم صدقة تطهرهم و تزكيهم بها و صلي عليهم إن صلاتك سكن لهم و الله سميع عليم   

"Take, [O, Muhammad], from their wealth a charity by which you purify them and cause them increase, and invoke [ Allah 's blessings] upon them. Indeed, your invocations are reassurance for them. And Allah is Hearing and Knowing."
 

The part that is mentioned is و تزكيهم بها  " wa tuzakkeehim bihaa "

It says that they say this means تُطهِّرُهم  tutahhiruhum: it purifies them

Tutahhiruhum is actually mentioned just previous to 'wa tuzakeehim' in the above passage. In my opinion understanding tazkiyah as tat-heer in THIS PARTICULAR context would be a little too redundant. I would use some of its other meaning which we will see below.

Then it says that Zakaah means صفوةُ الشيء which is 'the purity of a thing.

Zakaah is afterwards again defined as righteous or correct acts i.e. العمل الصالح

Then we have another explanation for what is taken out for the poor being part of their rights (min huqooqihim), or what they are entitled to (the use of rights here is a dead give away that this is a shar'iah or pos-Quranic Islamic opinion) being called Zakaah because it purifies the wealth, makes it produce, is a form of making things right/correct, i.e. rectification and is a form of growth. The original statement is below:

قيل لما يُخْرَج من المال للمساكين من حقوقهم زَكاةٌ لأَنه تطهيرٌ للمال وتَثْميرٌ وإِصْلاحٌ ونماء،

The nail in the coffin is this statement:

وأَصل الزكاة في اللغة الطهارة والنَّماء والبَركةُ والمَدْح وكله قد استعمل في القرآن والحديث

"The original meaning of Zakaah in the Classical Arabic language is purity, growth, blessing and commendation/praise/acclaim."

This is also essentially the first sentence in Mu'jam Al-faadh Al-Quran

It says that "the original meaning of Zakaah is growth that attains God's blessing and is used with worldly affairs and afterworldly affairs. It is said that what was planted zakaa (past tense, singular masculine) and yazkoo (present tense, singular, masculine) if it attains growth and blessing. And the verse that says أيها ازكا طعاما ('Ayyuhaa azkaa ta3aaman i.e 'which is better to eat.' Here azkaa is the superlative of zakeey) and indicates what is lawful and has no unwholesome consequences. From this comes Zakaah as what men owe to God for the poor and it is called this because it is seeking blessing or purification of the soul or its growth with what is good and with blessings."

Both Lisanul-Arab and Mu'jam Al-faadh Al-Quran state that the original meaning of the word in Classical Arabic is growth, purity, blessing and praise (only Lisanul-Arab says praise).  Additionally they use Al-Zakaah as charity in connection to the rights (huqooq) of those in need and what we owe to God (literally the rights of God, haqqullah) making this meaning clearly Islamic and therefore post-Quranically theological in meaning.

Zakaah as charity is in essence a post-Quranic, Islamic nickname for charity (saduqah/sadaqah) because of how it implies growth for others and for our souls, because it is good, productive, purifies us and brings God's blessing on us.

The reasons for Zakaah being taken as a nickname for charity can be found in 9:103 where sadaqah is said to be tazkiyah for us; zakaah (purity) and tazkiyah (purification) being essentially interchangeable. I'm sure in a number of hadeeth which also have been taken as a basis for nicknaming sadaqah Zakaah.

I hope this has helped.





 

Offline Deliverance

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Re: The meaning of "ZaKAt"
« Reply #22 on: June 27, 2014, 08:00:09 PM »
Thank you for your post Anwar,

As i posted previously "zakah" was used by Prophets of old like Abbraham so it is not just an islamic usage.
Sura 2"
And remember We took a covenant from the children of Israel (to this effect): worship none but Allah; treat with kindness your parents and kindred, and orphans and those in need; speak fair to the people; be steadfast in prayer; and give Zakat. then did ye turn back except a few among you, and ye backslide (even now). (83)

Thats why it is found in other semetic languages as purity

Offline Saba

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Re: The meaning of "ZaKAt"
« Reply #23 on: June 27, 2014, 10:50:34 PM »
Alright Saba i leave you alone.

salam aleikoum

Thanx Deliverance for agreeing with my request.


Salaam Anwar

Don't take this wrong but I really don't share your criticisms of Edward Lane's work. If you read his preface, he goes into great detail and tells you what his work contains and he uses many authorities including the TA and the Lisan. I don't know what your agenda against this work is but that isn't really my concern.

http://www.studyquran.org/LaneLexicon/Volume1/00000032.pdf
http://www.studyquran.org/LaneLexicon/Volume1/00000031.pdf

He provides references and yes, those that want to look deeper can access the authorities he references.
Saba



Offline Anwar

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Re: The meaning of "ZaKAt"
« Reply #24 on: June 28, 2014, 04:03:56 AM »
Deliverance,

I'm not sure I fully understand what you posted. The Quran is using the Classical Arabic term Zakaah. We have no evidence that this is the actual word used by Abraham (God bless and keep him) in his native language but we know that whatever words he used he communicated what the Quran is communicating. To review other Semitic languages on this point is irrelevant because we are only dealing with Classical Arabic. What we are trying to figure out is what is meant by Zakaah and the phrase Eetaa'uz-zakaah. I did my best to show you what is meant through some authentic and authoritative sources on the language. It is a predictable linguistic occurrence that the root would have a similar meaning in related languages. But it would be wrong for me to define Italian words using Spanish or Portuguese words using Romanian. I hope I have been efficient at demonstrating the principal and original Classical Arabic meaning of Zakaah as purity, goodness, growth, blessing and acclaim/praise.

Salam.

Offline QM Moderators Team

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Re: The meaning of "ZaKAt"
« Reply #25 on: June 28, 2014, 10:22:03 AM »
Anwar and Saba

This is your final warning and if you both continue with personal jibes in contravention of this forum's policy, you will be banned. No further warnings will be given. Comments of a personal nature which have no relevance to the content of the thread have been removed from the last few posts.

No one is forcing either of you to write on this forum. Respect this forum's policy and the expected level of conversation etiquettes. If you cannot adhere to the forum policy, please go and post your thoughts some place else.

No further warnings will be given to either of you!

Thanks!

Offline Wakas

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Re: The meaning of "ZaKAt"
« Reply #26 on: July 02, 2014, 08:56:05 PM »

Lisanul-Arab first has Zakaah as righteousness/correctness (Al-Salaa7) and has Az-zakaah as zakaatul-maal, i.e. zakaah as zakaah of the wealth (this is already logically problematic). He goes on to say that this is known and that it is purification (tat-heer) of one's wealth. He adds that it is "what you take out from your wealth in order to purify it." I don't know if you see the logical flaws here but the first is in explaining al-zakaah using the same word again, and stating that it is zakaah of one's wealth, which is then explained as purifying one's wealth. This already intimates that Zakaah as purity is the stronger and more original meaning. 

It also begs questions such as did the pre-Islamic Arabs have a concept of purifying wealth or setting aside some of one's wealth in order to purify it? And is this even a Quranically valid concept? Does the wealth we earn morally and within Quranic guidelines need to be purified?

What is mentioned next is a partial phrase from 9:103.

خذ من أموالهم صدقة تطهرهم و تزكيهم بها و صلي عليهم إن صلاتك سكن لهم و الله سميع عليم   

"Take, [O, Muhammad], from their wealth a charity by which you purify them and cause them increase, and invoke [ Allah 's blessings] upon them. Indeed, your invocations are reassurance for them. And Allah is Hearing and Knowing."
 

The part that is mentioned is و تزكيهم بها  " wa tuzakkeehim bihaa "

It says that they say this means تُطهِّرُهم  tutahhiruhum: it purifies them

Tutahhiruhum is actually mentioned just previous to 'wa tuzakeehim' in the above passage. In my opinion understanding tazkiyah as tat-heer in THIS PARTICULAR context would be a little too redundant. I would use some of its other meaning which we will see below.

Then it says that Zakaah means صفوةُ الشيء which is 'the purity of a thing.

Zakaah is afterwards again defined as righteous or correct acts i.e. العمل الصالح

Then we have another explanation for what is taken out for the poor being part of their rights (min huqooqihim), or what they are entitled to (the use of rights here is a dead give away that this is a shar'iah or pos-Quranic Islamic opinion) being called Zakaah because it purifies the wealth, makes it produce, is a form of making things right/correct, i.e. rectification and is a form of growth. The original statement is below:

قيل لما يُخْرَج من المال للمساكين من حقوقهم زَكاةٌ لأَنه تطهيرٌ للمال وتَثْميرٌ وإِصْلاحٌ ونماء،

The nail in the coffin is this statement:

وأَصل الزكاة في اللغة الطهارة والنَّماء والبَركةُ والمَدْح وكله قد استعمل في القرآن والحديث

"The original meaning of Zakaah in the Classical Arabic language is purity, growth, blessing and commendation/praise/acclaim."

This is also essentially the first sentence in Mu'jam Al-faadh Al-Quran

It says that "the original meaning of Zakaah is growth that attains God's blessing and is used with worldly affairs and afterworldly affairs. It is said that what was planted zakaa (past tense, singular masculine) and yazkoo (present tense, singular, masculine) if it attains growth and blessing. And the verse that says أيها ازكا طعاما ('Ayyuhaa azkaa ta3aaman i.e 'which is better to eat.' Here azkaa is the superlative of zakeey) and indicates what is lawful and has no unwholesome consequences. From this comes Zakaah as what men owe to God for the poor and it is called this because it is seeking blessing or purification of the soul or its growth with what is good and with blessings."

Both Lisanul-Arab and Mu'jam Al-faadh Al-Quran state that the original meaning of the word in Classical Arabic is growth, purity, blessing and praise (only Lisanul-Arab says praise).  Additionally they use Al-Zakaah as charity in connection to the rights (huqooq) of those in need and what we owe to God (literally the rights of God, haqqullah) making this meaning clearly Islamic and therefore post-Quranically theological in meaning.

Zakaah as charity is in essence a post-Quranic, Islamic nickname for charity (saduqah/sadaqah) because of how it implies growth for others and for our souls, because it is good, productive, purifies us and brings God's blessing on us.

The reasons for Zakaah being taken as a nickname for charity can be found in 9:103 where sadaqah is said to be tazkiyah for us; zakaah (purity) and tazkiyah (purification) being essentially interchangeable. I'm sure in a number of hadeeth which also have been taken as a basis for nicknaming sadaqah Zakaah.

I hope this has helped.





 

Thanks for the classical arabic dictionary information.