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Messages - ilker

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General Discussions / Re: Understanding what is doubts in the quran
« on: April 14, 2017, 02:30:47 AM »
No not really....don't get me wrong but i think your point is a little desperate.

"Desperate" is not a nice word to use here, sounds belittling. I don't know what "covenant" are you talking about ? I haven't come across any translation with the word "covenant" for this surah.

Anyways, what do you imply by saying i didn't quote "the whole surah" ? I simply wanted the emphasize the last ayat to show you my thoughts on this. Why did you find it necessary to point out that you have quoted the whole surah without parantheses ?

Finally, what is your perspective on Surah Quraysh ? Don't you think we have anything to extract from it ? Do you think it's unnecesary for us ?

General Discussions / Re: Understanding what is doubts in the quran
« on: April 14, 2017, 01:19:13 AM »
Salam all,

Dear Zack, i'm not literalist or contextualist. I am not interested in labeling myself as such. In my opinion, every ayah, every event in the Quran gives us a message, to all humanity. They simply cannot be ruled out even if we live in a different time period. This has nothing to do with being a literalist.

Duster, so you find surah Quraish irrelevant for our time ?

"Let them worship the Lord of this House, Who has fed them, [saving them] from hunger and made them safe, [saving them] from fear."

When you read this what do you think ? Who saves you from hunger and makes you safe ? Who feeds you ? Yes, situations/events are different ! Can you say what has been said about Quraysh doesn't concern you today ? I think "the message" is still relevant. Did you get my point ?

Relearning, thanks for sharing your thoughts but, with all due respect, i don't agree with them. So Allah(swt) made interest haram back then but now it's unavoidable for today's world, so those ayat are invalid now ? Is this what you think ? How is this different from the concept of abrogation in principle ?

p.s. I don't mean to argue with anyone here, these are just my thoughts. Sorry for my English.

Yes relearning I am from Turkey :)

General Discussions / Re: Understanding what is doubts in the quran
« on: April 13, 2017, 10:28:27 PM »
My general understanding of quran that it is direct audience is the arabians lived in the era of its revelation. Not everything in it concerns us accept general guidelines. Quran must be understood in a historical frame which is bound by time and place of it is origin. I dont take everything literally from quran therefore your being feeling guilty or not regarding being doubtfull of anything in quran for my humble view is unnecessary.


Can you please give at least one example for an ayah/situation/event that doesn't concern us and/or benefit us or that we do not have to take as a lesson today ?

General Discussions / Re: Understanding what is doubts in the quran
« on: April 05, 2017, 12:44:13 AM »
Assalam alikum the quran says never to doubt and I understand that

But it says that if you doubt you are a hypocrite and if you die you go to hell but we all have some doubts because that's what makes us human so I really confused because if you have some doubt would that make you go to hell because if yes that would be the majority of us

Abraham had some doubts but he was a prophet and asked god to show him how to raise the dead to reassure his mind and heart

So I'm really confused by whitch doubts make you a hypocrite and whitch doubts are fine like abraham

Because it makes it sound like any doubt makes you a hypocrite and you will go to hell but I know that's not the case because of Abraham

I'm mean is there a thing called doubts in the mind and and doubts in the heart is there a difference between the two


you say: "Abraham had some doubts but he was a prophet and asked god to show him how to raise the dead to reassure his mind and heart."

I don't think he doubted. Allah asks him if he believed or not. He said "i do believe". What i think he asked was to see "how Allah raises the dead" with his own eyes, in the flesh. He simply wanted to be a live witness to the event, to calm his heart. You know the sun will set but you want to witness it. Because it's fascinating to watch it live.

General Discussions / Re: 5:101 and 57:14
« on: April 04, 2017, 06:09:10 PM »
Salamun alaykum all

About the definition of fitnah:

General Discussions / Re: History
« on: March 24, 2017, 03:23:13 AM »
Salamun alaykum all,

Dear Duster I understand your point but you should try to stay calm :) People can be very impatient at times no matter how many times they get warned. Keep in mind this beautiful ayah (the essence, the message of it) inshaAllah :) Maybe this ayah was revealed for "a particular crowd" but still I think it applies to all people who we communicate with. Sometimes when i get angry at someone,  this ayah comes to my mind (Alhamdulillah !):

"Thus it is due to mercy from Allah that you deal with them gently, and had you been rough, hard hearted, they would certainly have dispersed from around you; pardon them therefore and ask pardon for them, and take counsel with them in the affair; so when you have decided, then place your trust in Allah; surely Allah loves those who trust."

Discussions / Re: Similarity between a Bible verse and a Hadith
« on: March 23, 2017, 01:21:07 AM »
Wa alykum wa salam brother Ahmad

In my humble opinion, I would not doubt that this could of been said by prophet Muhammad(pbuh). To think prophet Muhammad did not have any knowledge about the previous Scriptures after or during the Quran was being revealed to him is unwarranted. Did someone narrate this hadith correctly? Possibly. Do we know for certainty? Possibly not.

I find neither the hadith nor the Biblical verse you mentioned shed any tension on the verses of the Quran.

It actually maybe confirmed by the Quran by that heaven is unseen, still an abode for the believers who love the Lord.

Salam :)


Brother Hamzeh while I support your opinion above, I would like to know the reason why you wrote:

" To think prophet Muhammad did not have any knowledge about the previous Scriptures after or during the Quran was being revealed to him is unwarranted."

We know from the Quran that Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) was Ummi. I'm not saying illiterate, I'm saying he was "ummi". Brother Joseph talked about this in:

I also don't think he had any knowledge about the previous scriptures.

"And thus We have revealed to you an inspiration of Our command. You did not know what is the Book or [what is] faith, but We have made it a light by which We guide whom We will of Our servants. And indeed, [O Muhammad], you guide to a straight path." (42:52)

"And you did not recite before it any scripture, nor did you inscribe one with your right hand. Otherwise the falsifiers would have had [cause for] doubt." (29:48)

So why do you think he could have knowledge about the previous Scriptures ? Can you elaborate on this ?

General Discussions / Re: hafs and warsh 18:36
« on: March 22, 2017, 12:28:22 AM »

The root of those words are the same  "q-t-l". Meanings are close. Someone fighting in a battle... They can be killed or they can survive. The message of the ayah remains clear. The root of the words remains the same...

Islamic Duties / Re: Janaza Prayers
« on: March 22, 2017, 12:12:56 AM »
Salam brothers...

According to this verse..does it mean that...we should not pray for the disbelievers?...what if they were our family?...what if they were atheist and our family?...can you please clear it...



"There has already been for you an excellent pattern in Abraham and those with him, when they said to their people, "Indeed, we are disassociated from you and from whatever you worship other than Allah . We have denied you, and there has appeared between us and you animosity and hatred forever until you believe in Allah alone" except for the saying of Abraham to his father, "I will surely ask forgiveness for you, but I have not [power to do] for you anything against Allah . Our Lord, upon You we have relied, and to You we have returned, and to You is the destination." (60:4)

"It is not for the Prophet and those who have believed to ask forgiveness for the polytheists, even if they were relatives, after it has become clear to them that they are companions of Hellfire. And the request of forgiveness of Abraham for his father was only because of a promise he had made to him. But when it became apparent to Abraham that his father was an enemy to Allah , he disassociated himself from him. Indeed was Abraham compassionate and patient." (9:113-114)

General Discussions / Re: Reconciling verse 4:93
« on: March 07, 2017, 04:41:56 PM »
wa alaykum salam

about 4:93, what I think when I read this ayah is that the believers have a really special status for Allah (swt), he separately mentions and emphasizes the punishment for killing one of them. (Though it's just my interpretation and Allah (swt) knows best.)

"Is one who worships devoutly during the hour of the night prostrating himself or standing (in adoration), who takes heed of the Hereafter, and who places his hope in the Mercy of his Lord - (like one who does not)? Say: "Are those equal, those who know and those who do not know? It is those who are endued with understanding that receive admonition." (39:9)

Without a doubt, Allah(swt) is Al-Rahman, the most merciful. He is the protector of all human beings! So, a general punishment for killing an innocent human is not just restricted to "believers".

"Because of that, We decreed upon the Children of Israel that whoever kills a soul unless for a soul or for corruption [done] in the land - it is as if he had slain mankind entirely. And whoever saves one - it is as if he had saved mankind entirely. And our messengers had certainly come to them with clear proofs. Then indeed many of them, [even] after that, throughout the land, were transgressors." (5:32)

General Discussions / Re: the word "hamr" in 47:15
« on: February 26, 2017, 07:17:46 PM »
Dear Ilker,

Wa alaikum assalam

The Quran made best use of an existing language / vernacular of the Arabs to make an argument clear. It was / is arguably not interested in root analysis and etymologies or of making use of words which don’t carry the most obvious nuance intended for that particular context. 

'Khamar' is a well-known noun meaning wine. It refers to the liquid (2:219; 5:90-91; 12:41) or process of making wine (12:36).

However, the Quran also goes out of its way to clarify that this particular 'wine' will not intoxicate (56:19).

I hope this helps, God willing


Alhamdulillah. Thanks for your reply :) JazakAllah khair. Dear Deliverance thanks for your contribution, but i was trying to learn about something else. Peace Duster.

General Discussions / the word "hamr" in 47:15
« on: February 25, 2017, 08:21:09 PM »
Salamun alaykum

First, I must say I did search 47:15 in the forum but i couldn't find a solid explanation in terms of grammar and coherence with other ayat that contain the word "hamr". Why do you think Allah(swt) uses this word for a river of "nonintoxicating" drink (56:19) in Jannah in 47:15 ?

I'm a little bit confused about this because i knew that the word "hamr" comes from the root of "to cover, to conceal" ,so it describes any kind of fluid which makes you drunk.

(I would also like to know what brother Joseph thinks about this ayah)

General Discussions / Re: meaning of 79:29
« on: February 24, 2017, 09:04:05 PM »
salam sharon,

i kindly recommend that you read the posts under this topic:

There are several replies related to the question you've asked.

May ALLAH (swt) guide us to His path, the truth. Have a nice friday inshaALLAH :)

General Discussions / Re: hafs and warsh 18:36
« on: February 21, 2017, 10:51:25 PM »

General Discussions / Re: Verse 2:34
« on: February 14, 2017, 06:25:09 AM »
peace ilker,

How do you explain for example Surah Sad 71-78 and other similar ayat

Can you please clarify and be more specific, i.e. what in those verses?

I forgot to say earlier in the thread. Some of the quotes in my post were not from me. They were from the threads referenced if I recall correctly.

peace Student,

What are the main issues you have with 2:31?

Salam wakas

I would like to hear the "whole passage" from 71-78 or even 71-85 based on your own concept of "iblees". About your theory of the non-existence of iblees prior to the creation of man, I wrote a few things about it too in my original post and I would like to hear your opinion again. Finally, do you agree that "iblees" was acting in accordance with the purpose of his creation and he is not to blame for what he did or he didn't break the rule as you said ?

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